Cody Ko On Building A YouTube Empire, Partying With Elon & Stand-Up Comedy (#503)

Shaan Puri

"What 3 creators do you see that you think could become billionaires?" They say, "MrBeast, Dude Perfect," or something like that. And then they said to you, "No way! Cody, Cody, Cody..." [repeating 'Cody' multiple times for emphasis] Cody is topping off. The algorithm has shined upon him.

Cody Ko

cody is

Shaan Puri

one of the biggest youtubers on the platform

Shaan Puri

how did you get good at doing what you do

Cody Ko

If you go and listen to the first episode of my podcast, it was complete garbage. Right? If I'm thinking about what makes a good podcast, or what makes a good YouTube video, or what makes a good song, the number one thing you can do is...

Shaan Puri

how much are you thinking about like the business side of of what you're about

Cody Ko

Being a billionaire? No, no. When I was younger, it was literally just about the creative aspect. But now that I'm getting older, it's like I want the business to succeed. And then he looks at his phone and says, "Elon's been texting me," and then he showed us his phone.

Shaan Puri

it was like elon musk he was like come over and then he was like should we go over

Cody Ko

To his house. Yeah, I mean, you can't really say no to that. So we got in cars and drove to his house. When we got there, he and Grimes were standing on the driveway with lanterns. It's like, "Welcome to..."

Shaan Puri

why my house that's insane what's he like

Cody Ko

like it was one of those things where we

Shaan Puri

by the

Cody Ko

way I list I list this is like one of my favorite podcasts

Shaan Puri

oh hell yeah

Cody Ko

so it's an honor to be on it right

Shaan Puri

because I

Cody Ko

it's one of 2 that I listen to

Shaan Puri

that's not and so I'm not even sponsoring you guys amazing yeah

Cody Ko

No, I'm serious. So, like, when you hear me out, I was like, "Let's go!" I mean, it's all in. Yeah, obviously, but yeah.

Shaan Puri

it's like they're good too I like them too

Cody Ko

yeah so you guys just switched between you guys and in how I built this

Shaan Puri

And you... so you listen to the podcast, so you kinda know the vibe. And so I invited you to come on. Did you think about like, what are we gonna... because it's different than our normal episodes. My son's like, "Sam's not here." Second, you're like cool entertainment guy and we're usually like nerdy tech guys. What did you think was gonna happen on this?

Cody Ko

I like being the guest on a podcast. It's so much better than being the host of one, right? Because, like, that's your... right.

Shaan Puri

I gotta drive yes yeah yeah the pressure's on you

Cody Ko

I can just sit here and answer questions you know yeah

Shaan Puri

Good, okay. Well, that's what we're going to do. But the interesting thing is you actually started as this kind of nerdy tech guy too. "I did, yeah." You were, I think, like an iOS dev? "Yep." And let's start there. So the origin story is you go to Duke and you make a viral app at one... I don't know if we were at school or right after school.

Cody Ko

it was I it was during college

Shaan Puri

during college

Cody Ko

I was

Shaan Puri

what did it actually do so I know it was called cap that or icap that

Cody Ko

icap that

Shaan Puri

icap that

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

what it what's the app

Cody Ko

A very funny name, by the way. Yeah, so it was like I was a senior in college and I was on the diving team all four years. I didn't have any internships during the summers; I was just training. By the time I was a senior, I didn't have a resume, and all my peers were doing internships. They had jobs lined up for as soon as I graduated. I didn't have anything, and that kind of scared me because I'm Canadian and I wanted to stay in the States. So, I needed a visa, which means I needed a job. I also just needed money and stuff for when I graduated.

Shaan Puri

like what

Cody Ko

The fuck am I gonna do? So, I was studying computer science at that time, and they didn't have an iOS class. But I was obsessed with my phone, obviously, and I was like, "I really want to know how to make an app." So, I just bought a book and taught myself. You know, the way you really teach yourself something is... sure, you can read and watch YouTube videos, but it's by thinking of a project and then trying to make it come to life, right? So, that was my project. There was one that did something similar, but it was a paid app. I was like, "Oh, this is a perfect opportunity because it's not a hard idea."

Shaan Puri

and what was the idea so you're captioning

Cody Ko

yeah basically like pictures

Shaan Puri

or like as a meme meme generator

Cody Ko

Basically, yeah. It was like you would select a picture from your library or take a picture, and then it had an internal database of funny captions that we all just... got drunk and came up with. So it would automatically apply one to the picture in white font, but all the captions were sort of general enough where people thought there was like AI going on.

Shaan Puri

like what's an example like what do you mean

Cody Ko

Like, I don't know, a super... I guess a stupid one would be like you'd take a picture of someone in here and it would be like "addicted to cocaine" or something like that. People would see that and be like, "Hey, he is! That's so true, he does look like a cocaine addict." So, the way I got it to spread is that it got rejected by the Apple review board, you know, multiple times for being inappropriate. I was like, "Hey, I can't make this app clean because then it's not funny, right? And it won't do anything." So, I basically wrote some code so that the internal database was timed. I knew the app review process took about a week, right? So, after seven days, it would release all the dirty captions. That way, I got by the Apple review system.

Shaan Puri

amazing

Cody Ko

And then everyone was like, "Oh my God, this app is so wild! Look at this, there are swear words in it!" It just blew up. It was the number one app in the App Store.

Shaan Puri

you're just on campus

Cody Ko

above like ebay and Google and it was number 1 and I paid $0 for marketing

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

I'm on campus, and I don't know what to do because I know I should be making money from this, but I'm not. I have no idea how to make money or anything about business. I was talking to my friend, and I was like, "What do I do?" He said, "Dude, you should like sell ads." I was like, "I don't know how to even start to do that." I didn't know the first thing about setting up an ad SDK or anything.

Shaan Puri

and you also kinda know your shelf life like you know every day that you're the top is great

Cody Ko

exactly

Shaan Puri

and it might not be the case a 100 days from now when I figure this out

Cody Ko

And when you blow up that fast, the graph goes the other way just as quickly, right? So, I was stressing about what to do, and I got an email from a CEO of a startup in Palo Alto. He was like, "Hey, I saw your app. I love it! I want to hire you and buy the app." I was like, "Perfect! Yeah, that worked out." Which was cool for me because, growing up, you know, being obsessed with Apple and Steve Jobs, I was like, "Silicon Valley is like a dream. That's where I'd want to end up." But is this it? This is the app?

Shaan Puri

this is it yeah amazing

Cody Ko

No, this is "I'd Cap That 2," the sequel. So, like, when this company...

Shaan Puri

I'm surprised you didn't go with like dose or something it was like I know right

Cody Ko

Did I tell you this on my podcast? No? Okay. So, I took a trip to Palo Alto and fell in love with it. I met the team, and they loved me. We just got along great. It was a mobile ad SDK company. Yep, it was a mobile ad network. They needed my app to drive traffic through the network, and I needed money and a job. So, it was pretty mutually beneficial. They acquired the app for $50,000—half in cash and half in stock—which was great for me. It was a nice lump sum to get an apartment and furniture. Then, my first job was to make a sequel that was a paid version. Oh no, actually, my first job was to make an I Cap That +, which was the paid version.

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

and we we launched it and immediately it made $200 and I was like

Shaan Puri

damn it wow damn it

Cody Ko

you should've just done this by myself

Shaan Puri

You're early to the Apple TV+ train, man. But there wasn't Apple TV+. We did ESPN+. You were... you were... I invented that. I pioneered that shit.

Cody Ko

I have it patented, actually. So then we made... I kept that too, and then we made... I kept that too plus, and we just milked this thing.

Shaan Puri

how much is this you think the whole dinner

Cody Ko

made like half a $1,000,000 or something

Shaan Puri

like that

Cody Ko

but then it you know then it died

Shaan Puri

Yeah, but... and so you had that run of like, you're doing that on campus. So you got the taste of the thrill of making something succeeding, kinda failing but also succeeding at the same time. Where was your head at at that? What are you thinking at that moment? Are you like, "Oh, I could just do this again," or what was your approach after that?

Cody Ko

like after I got the job

Shaan Puri

Just like after you had gone through that experience, did you think, "I'm going to do this again," or what was your...?

Cody Ko

It definitely was my first little taste of independent success. That definitely gave me a little courage. My plan was, "Okay, I'm just gonna stay at this company, work my ass off, and try to do what I can to make this thing a success," so that the stock, you know, becomes something. That didn't happen, but it was definitely my first little taste of success. Before that, I had never felt momentum like that before, where something's working and the graph is going up and to the right. You're like, "Oh my god, I'm onto something!"

Shaan Puri

Right, and then you tasted that again when you started doing content, right? Vine content was the next time you experienced that kind of crazy virality.

Cody Ko

I actually that was more everything since then has been more linear

Shaan Puri

really

Cody Ko

Yeah, like I've never been... You see creators all the time that blow up out of nowhere. Like, you know, this year it was like Alex Earl or something like that.

Shaan Puri

sure

Cody Ko

or who else like the octopus octopussy kid

Shaan Puri

do you know him no anyways it happens it seems like it's promising though

Cody Ko

he sounds like he's really talking

Shaan Puri

like a gym

Cody Ko

He's really funny, but for me, it was always like I kind of had to grind my way to having an audience. I literally downloaded Vine and made videos every single day. I was actually pretty late; I would say the whole first class of famous Viners had already been a thing, like King Bach and Brittany Furlan. They were already people that everyone recognized. So when I downloaded it, I didn't do it with the intention of being somebody or generating an audience or anything like that. I was actually working on a social media app for this company, and it was like Snapchat for video, basically. Then Snapchat for video came out.

Shaan Puri

I started to add a video

Cody Ko

We were like, "Damn it!" So basically, I was just keeping tabs on all the new apps that were coming out. When Vine came out, I downloaded it and started playing around with it. I lived alone in Palo Alto at the time, and as a 21-year-old, it was the most boring life imaginable. So, I would get home from work and suddenly start feeling like I was flexing my creative muscle, something I hadn't done in a long time. It felt good. Every day, I would just make more videos. I got involved in the community, making online friends with other people who were also gaining some traction. Then, I started showing up on the popular page, and people began recognizing my face. I just kept doing it. I genuinely didn't try to make it a job; I treated programming as my job and this as my hobby. I wanted to treat it like an art, and that sort of paid off because I think people liked the sincerity behind it.

Shaan Puri

And you... what do you mean by that? So, like, for the people that were... a skip compare the people that were trying really hard to become famous on Vine and what you were doing. What do you think was different to the outsider?

Cody Ko

I think "selling out" was a much more obvious thing back then, or a much more binary thing. Whereas now, it's completely expected. It's like someone takes off and they start doing ad reads, and their fans are like, "Yeah, get the bag! Let's go!" Whereas back then, it was different. First of all, six seconds is really hard to endorse something in naturally.

Shaan Puri

say get the bag it's exactly so it

Cody Ko

It was pretty obvious when people started making money, and then others would say, "You know, you sold out. You're not the same." I think it helped that I had an actual job on the side where I was making decent money.

Shaan Puri

but you've got to a couple million followers right

Cody Ko

Yeah, I think I had like 3 or 4 or something on Vine.

Shaan Puri

I was wondering if something like that or

Cody Ko

maybe 2 I don't know

Shaan Puri

what happened to vine

Cody Ko

I think it was just a little bit ahead of its time. Because I think now, I mean, if it came out like 5 years ago, I feel like it would have worked.

Shaan Puri

but it was kinda working then and then they just like turned it off

Cody Ko

I think it was because when Twitter bought it before... Yeah, they launched it and it really worked, but then the traffic started tapering off. I think they were at a crossroads where they were like, "We can't monetize just our website."

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

like twitter was having a really hard time monetizing I think it still is

Shaan Puri

Wasn't there like a meeting with creators where the creators said, "We want money," and Twitter was like, "Nah"? And then wasn't there some famous showdown?

Cody Ko

Something like that, where they... yeah, I think they were in a room with like King Bach and those people. They were like, "We want this much money to keep posting," and they're like, "We don't have it."

Shaan Puri

right they're like okay

Cody Ko

yeah yeah yeah so they're like actually we're just gonna shut it shut down

Shaan Puri

the whole thing instead you want more money how about no platform

Cody Ko

oh okay

Shaan Puri

So, you... okay, so you go through that. You guys have had... you've been doing content on like podcast, YouTube for... like over 10 years probably, almost, right?

Cody Ko

yeah almost

Shaan Puri

What, and you said it's kind of linear. So if I asked, "What was kind of a breakout for you?" Or like, the breakout moments or things that you remember were like, "Oh shit, things just got different for me." Like, "Something is different. I don't know exactly how big this is, but... something changed."

Cody Ko

I remember the first time that I hit **1,000,000 views** overnight. It was for a "That's Cringe" video, which is now one of the most viewed series on my channel. I remember we did a couple of these videos, and they seemed to be working; people seemed to be into them. However, it wasn't apparent how much more people liked them compared to the other stuff I was doing. Then we posted the third or fourth one, and I remember waking up to **1,000,000 views**. I was like, "Oh my god, that is unfathomable for me, you know, even five months ago." Those numbers just didn't make sense to me. That was one pretty distinctive moment. Another one was when Noel and I went on tour for the first time, and then the second time, and all the times after that. The tickets would just sell out, and I was like, "I can't believe that this is now converting into real-world sales where people want to come to a venue and see us in person." That felt really cool. It's always a weirdly sobering thing.

Shaan Puri

What do you guys do when you do that? Because we did... we've done, I think we did two live shows this year. Those times they, like, you know, people showed up, which was shocking in the moment and afterwards. But also we were like, "What the... what do they want?" Like, what are we supposed to do? Pod? Like, you wanna just do the podcast in front of you while you're sitting here?

Cody Ko

like yeah I know

Shaan Puri

That's boring, I think. Yeah, and we try to do a bunch of stuff. I personally hate it. I hate... I'm like, "I don't really wanna do that again" because, you know, your series is called "That's Cringe." That's in my head. I was like, "This is cringe right now. What's happening is a little bit cringe." What do you guys actually do when you do your live stuff?

Cody Ko

We did, so like the first couple of shows that we did were just on stage, like podcasts. Because the same thing, we didn't really know what people wanted to see.

Shaan Puri

I'm not

Cody Ko

sure they're buying tickets for a live podcast

Shaan Puri

people sitting quietly listening to podcast

Cody Ko

show is like a 100 or something like that

Shaan Puri

or whatever there's a crowd of people just watching the podcast

Cody Ko

yeah and that went well

Shaan Puri

but you guys are funny I think that's the thing they're laughing so it's kind of a comedy show

Cody Ko

yeah yeah yeah

Shaan Puri

so I think that works

Cody Ko

But then after that, we did another tour where we were like, "Hey, we can't... we need something that's gonna guarantee laughs, and we really want to put effort into this." So then we wrote a show, and we started writing songs for the show. It kind of became like: - A third music - A third live sort of... that's cringe that we did on stage - And a third just stand-up comedy

Shaan Puri

wow

Cody Ko

because noelle was a stand up before we started doing anything together so he kinda already had chops

Shaan Puri

and in research for this I saw a video of you doing stand up

Cody Ko

what

Shaan Puri

yeah where there's a video of you

Cody Ko

oh my god please please do not look that up

Shaan Puri

please for the love of god

Cody Ko

I I do not wanna see that oh it's on my own channel dude

Shaan Puri

I'm taking that it wasn't that hard for me to do the research. By the way, what's it like doing stand-up?

Cody Ko

**Horrifying. Horrifying. The thing is, I DJ now.**

Shaan Puri

yeah I've heard

Cody Ko

And so I like that it's in front of people, and I find myself a lot more comfortable, obviously, because it's not just you and the mic and the audience. It's like there's something in between, which is already awesome. You know, it's like music.

Shaan Puri

right so you for live shows you guys are like turning it into like a full yeah by the end of the

Cody Ko

tour because we did a we we toured the whole world

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

And we did, like, I don't know... maybe 100 shows or something like that. So by the end, it's like we had the show literally word-for-word scripted and memorized. When you do it that many times, it just becomes the same show. Then you alter it a little bit every time. If something gets a laugh, you'll add that back for the next one, and it kind of evolves.

Shaan Puri

So, we had Samir from Colin and Samir in here yesterday. I asked him a question, like, I think we had said something like, "Yo, who are the three creators you see that could become billionaires?" He talked about MrBeast, which was great. I asked, "Who else do you think has that pathway or potential?" He mentioned MrBeast again, and then he said he forgot who he said—maybe Dude Perfect or something like that. And then he said, "You."

Cody Ko

no way

Shaan Puri

yeah

Cody Ko

really

Shaan Puri

Yeah, and I was like, "That's amazing!" Because he named 50 other YouTubers, by the way, during the episode. I was like, "Oh cool, I've never heard of these people," because I'm not like... in the YouTube culture. I have the things I like, and I'm not everywhere on YouTube. And I was like, "Dude, he's coming in here tomorrow. I'm gonna tell him this and see how he reacts." And you sound surprised.

Cody Ko

I definitely am surprised

Shaan Puri

You know, the thing he said wasn't like he's going to be... He's like, "They could." He's like, "It's up to them." He's like, "They totally can if they choose to optimize in that direction." They are like the ones who have the audience, the intelligence, and the capability to do stuff there. Or they might take that energy in a different direction.

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

I also, I was telling Ben on the way over here, I feel like you and Noelle could do a "Harold and Kumar Go to White Castle" movie.

Cody Ko

yes yeah yeah so we are working on something I can't really say too much about it

Shaan Puri

I'm a believer that that's like you so in your guys' wheelhouse I

Cody Ko

think it'd be a lot of fun

Shaan Puri

I remember, when I was younger, I acted in a movie as a kid. I was a kid actor, you know? My older brother in the movie was Kal Penn, who is...

Cody Ko

oh okay yeah yeah

Shaan Puri

And so he called me one day and he was like, "Hey, how's school going?" I didn't even know what to say. I asked him, "What are you doing now?" He's like, "Oh, I'm filming *Harold and Kumar Go to White Castle*." To me, I didn't even understand what that was. I didn't know what White Castle was; there were none where I was at. So I thought it was a fantasy movie. I was like, "Oh yeah, I guess he's going to some fantasy epic castle thing." I remember going to school and telling my friends about it.

Cody Ko

why did he call you

Shaan Puri

he was just checking in on me what he was just a nice guy he was just a nice guy so you were

Cody Ko

like friends with him after that

Shaan Puri

Because, like, you were saying, when you go on tour, you hang out, like, in a movie. It's the same thing on a set. I just spoke at Duke, actually, and I went up on stage and I was like, "Oh, I look totally different than when I was 11." I was like, "Yay!" And then he was like, "He probably has no clue who I am." That's really funny.

Cody Ko

he seems like a nice guy

Shaan Puri

Oh, he's ultra nice, really nice guy. He's also... I really like about him is he just like grinded super, super hard. At the time, there were like no Indian actors. The only Indian acting jobs he could get was like, "You're the convenience store guy" or "You're [the guy with a] thick accent." I remember talking to him on set. I was like, "What are you gonna do after this?" And he's like... he's talking to his agent or something, and he just kept turning down roles because he's like, "They just want me to be the stereotypical Indian guy."

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

And I was like, "Okay, cool. So what are you gonna do instead?" He's like, "I don't have anything and there's no instead." I was like, "So...?" And he's like, "I have no money and I'm just gonna... I'm gonna just wait till I get a real..." He's like, "If I do that, I'll never get out of that."

Cody Ko

yeah yeah

Shaan Puri

So, I'm just gonna risk it all and grind through this... of not having anything until I get there.

Cody Ko

That's funny. I took an acting class one time, and I've told this story before on my own podcast. They were talking about leaning into your typecast at the beginning of your career. You have to do what you look like in order to get your foot in the door, right? So we did this exercise where we all went around in a circle. It was a room full of students, about 20 of us. We all had a journal, and we would look at each other one by one and write down what we thought their typecast was. Then we all revealed them, basically one by one. The teacher would point to one of us, and then the rest of the students would read what they wrote about that person. It was like "doctor," "scientist," you know, "race car driver," cool stuff. Then it got to me, and they said, "influencer, cokehead, DJ, sells coke in the bathroom." It was literally like five minutes of just the most offensive stuff about how I looked like a douchebag. I was like, "Damn." But I mean, I guess that's...

Shaan Puri

You're an influencer and a DJ now. I don't know too much about your lifestyle, but like me too.

Cody Ko

yeah this is what ended up happening

Shaan Puri

Yeah, he nailed it. He actually had a similar experience. He got a call and they said, "Oh yeah, I'm going to be on CSI." And they're like, "CSI? It's a terrorist plot!" He was like, "Oh man, come on, dude, goddamn it." What he did was change his name. His name is not actually Kal Penn; it's like Kolpin Modi. He said, "I'm not getting any auditions for the roles I want," so he created a fake name by splitting his first name. Then he started getting calls in. When he showed up, he wasn't white, and they were like, "Oh, okay, you're here. Go ahead and read for the role and see what happens." And then he got it! Actually, the funny thing is, one of the bigger roles he got was as an Indian doctor on *House*. I thought it was funny how he split the difference. He didn't do the accent, but it was still kind of stereotypical in a way. Did you, when you were trying to get better at what you were doing, how did you do that? Because obviously, you get better by just doing reps. But sometimes, if I want to improve at something, I might hire a coach, read a book, take a class, or study and break down people who are already good at it. How did you get good at what you do? Was there any intentional process you went through?

Cody Ko

I think a lot of the time, if I'm thinking about what makes a good podcast, what makes a good YouTube video, or what makes a good song, I'll just consume a lot of it and think about it a lot. But I mean, the number one thing you can do is just do it. You just learn by doing, at least for me. So that's how I've gotten good—it's just reps over time. Because if you go and listen to my first episode of my podcast, it was complete garbage.

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

It's just something I've gotten better at. I'm still not that great at it, but I've improved through the years.

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

And now I'm going through that sort of experience with music production too. I'm at the beginning stage where everything I make is a little bit better. I'm just leaning into the joy of conquering the 0 to 1 phase. Yeah, just learning to enjoy that part of the learning curve, I think, is really important.

Shaan Puri

What are some things you figured out that made, let's say, the cringe series, which now has like, I don't know, 150 million views? That style of video that you do—what's something you figured out? You're like, "Oh, I used to do it this way, then I figured out this and made it better."

Cody Ko

I don't know if it's really anything conscious. You know, it could... it's mostly stuff that you just innately pick up on when you do things over and over again. When you read comments and think about what people are reacting to. A lot of the time, it's like the first time we did a video like that. We were trying to riff and kind of stepping over each other's lines, jokes, and punchlines. The next time we did it, we got a little bit better at letting each other speak and breathe. One thing that I think we're really good at now is that we never speak over each other. We never interrupt. We're really good at riffing because we're innately conscious of the audience and what they want to hear. No one likes to hear people interrupting and stepping all over each other's jokes. So, stuff like that, we just get better at because you do it, you know?

Shaan Puri

I like that answer, even though I wanted you to say like "the trick." It's like a lesson I've had to relearn so many times that there is... you know, there are things that make things better, but there wasn't *the* trick. Yeah, it was like a shitload of reps, and caring, and then... you know, you just sort of get better with every rep.

Cody Ko

but there's like there's

Shaan Puri

Kind of boring. It's like, it's not the answer that's like, "Yes, I found the secret."

Cody Ko

I but it's

Shaan Puri

like that is the secret at the same time

Cody Ko

It wouldn't be fun if you went from 0 to good at something just by doing one little trick. I find so much joy in getting a little bit better at something every time I do it, and then seeing evidence of that improvement. You get that by posting online, right? Like the next time you do something, you suddenly get 5 comments saying, "Wow, this is better than the last one you did," and you're like, "**Fuck yeah!** I'm getting it!" You know? That drives me. I love that feeling.

Shaan Puri

We had Mark Manson come in court here the day before, and he has this thing he said: > "Happiness... people think happiness comes from not having problems. [But] happiness comes from solving problems."

Cody Ko

yeah totally

Shaan Puri

And I was like, "Oh yeah, that's so fucking true." The better version of that, it turns out, is when you feel like you chose that problem. So like if the weather is just bad, you know... it's like, "Oh, I didn't choose this, it's happening to me."

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

But if you're like, "No, I want to..." like for you, you're doing these long 50-mile races or 100-mile races or whatever. It's like you're choosing a set of problems that you're going to struggle with but also get satisfaction from as you overcome them. Right now, what are those for you? So it's like the endurance stuff. Maybe the business stuff is like that too for you, or no?

Cody Ko

yes for sure both of both of those things

Shaan Puri

Let's talk about the business stuff. On the business side, you know, a lot of these creators are building brands off their stuff, like products.

Cody Ko

yeah I mean for me

Shaan Puri

or divesting or other stuff are you doing any of that stuff

Cody Ko

I am... yeah, I'm developing something that I'm gonna launch in the fall. But for me, it was always kind of difficult. I would see people doing it and I was like, "Okay, this seems obvious." And then I would think: "Oh, the money that people are paying us to promote their products on the show..." Like ExpressVPN, for example. They've been a sponsor of the show for years, and they've probably paid us... you know, if we total it all up, it's like an insane amount of money, right? But their return on investment must have been way higher.

Shaan Puri

right otherwise they would have been crazy

Cody Ko

Continue to rebuy the ads year after year. So I'm like, why don't we just... it just makes sense for us to own something that we're promoting. Because then we see all the upside.

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

But it always kind of killed me thinking of the right thing because I don't want to force anything on my audience. Comedy is a very hard thing to align with a product or a service because it's just something that people enjoy. It's not, you know, it's not like fitness or cooking where there are products that people use every time they cook. With comedy, it's not like that. It's just, I don't know, generic and sort of... So when I started doing the endurance stuff, that's when I was like, "Oh, there's a lot of stuff that I'm doing every day that it's natural for me to promote."

Shaan Puri

and this is really cool cody's run club

Cody Ko

Yeah, so this is kind of my first product in this direction where I wanted to make something more fitness-focused. This is the first time I've done running shorts, for example.

Shaan Puri

When you're promoting it, are you... because that little video that was on there was kind of funny. Are you using the... are you leaning into the humor side? Or are you trying to be more serious when you're promoting the stuff?

Cody Ko

That's something I still kind of battle with myself over—how serious I want to be. Because, like, I always want to be like, "Comedy is a very easy crutch to lean on."

Shaan Puri

mhmm

Cody Ko

Because it's like... I like making fun of myself, and also if I'm a little bit self-conscious about something, it's like, "Oh, I was just joking." So, it's hard for me to sit in a studio and actually make a fitness video because I'm like, "I'm not *that* guy." I'm just doing endurance races because I like doing it and it's a challenge, but I'm not the guy that's out there like in slow-mo saying, "You can do anything!" You know? So I like to blend the two.

Shaan Puri

I mean, that was great! Like, you're on the bike and the guy's spraying... yeah, spraying them up in the mist in your face to make it look like you're sweating. That's great!

Cody Ko

So yeah, this is like my first time generating a product in the fitness lane. I'm going to do something else that I think will hopefully be a little bit bigger.

Shaan Puri

it'd be funny if you were just sort of the anti david goggins like just went the other way

Cody Ko

yeah stay soft

Shaan Puri

Yes, yeah. Marshmallows just sign off with something so, so incredibly soft. Do you listen to a lot of his stuff?

Cody Ko

I do. I mean, I read his book, his first book, and I've listened to his Joe Rogan episodes and stuff like that.

Shaan Puri

You should have... Have you read the book *Living with a Seal*? No? It's a great book. There's an entrepreneur named Jesse Itzler. Do you know him? Have you ever heard of this guy, Jesse Itzler? No? He married the woman who created Spanx.

Cody Ko

okay

Shaan Puri

he and then he created

Cody Ko

like spanx like the concept the action

Shaan Puri

no no no the shape or spanking

Cody Ko

yeah that

Shaan Puri

That would be a big idea. She and he created... he started off as a white rapper.

Cody Ko

then

Shaan Puri

He's always like, "White rapper." Then he's like, "Alright, not gonna make it as a rapper." So he's like, "I'm gonna work in a record label." So he's working at a record label. His intern was like this guy who's trying to be this rapper, trying to be all hard. He's like, "Yeah, I like this guy." It was 50 Cent. So 50 Cent was his intern for a little bit. 50 Cent goes off, blows up. So he's like, "Okay, I'm... he's like that guy like had it, I don't really have it." He's like, "What do I... what can I do?" He started creating jingles, like rap jingles.

Cody Ko

okay

Shaan Puri

So he's like... he created the Knicks theme song. You know, the New York Knicks? "Go Knicks Go" or whatever... "Go New York Go." And so he created sports jingles, like kind of quick raps for companies.

Cody Ko

okay

Shaan Puri

And then he sells that company for like, I don't know, $4,000,000. He said, "Alright, I got $4,000,000. I'll split it between the two guys. What are we going to do now that we have $2,000,000?" After they sold, they met a rich guy who took them on a private jet. They were flying in this private jet and they were like, "This is amazing! We would love to do this more." They thought, "We can't afford a jet, so it would be cool if you could just own a couple of rides on a jet, like a piece of a jet. What if I could just fly on a jet 10 times? That would be amazing!" So, they created that and ended up selling it—NetJets or something.

Shaan Puri

or they

Shaan Puri

Sold it to NetJets. So there was like Marquis, I think it was that, and they sold it to NetJets, which is owned by Warren Buffett. That was a huge sale. Now he owns a piece of an NBA team. He also invested a bunch in Zico Coconut Water early on when he was like, "Oh, coconut water's gonna be a big thing."

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

because he's an endurance athlete

Cody Ko

oh nice okay

Shaan Puri

He loved doing long runs, and he was like, "The running community loves coconut water. I think mainstream is going to too."

Cody Ko

yeah so

Shaan Puri

He found a small brand that wasn't doing that well, put a bunch of money in, and they ended up selling it to Coke later.

Cody Ko

I listened to that how I built this episode it's that's like one of my favorites

Shaan Puri

the coconut water one yeah

Cody Ko

if you're looking for a good one

Shaan Puri

yeah

Cody Ko

look look up that episode and watch that it's great

Shaan Puri

I can't find this client info

Hubspot

Have you heard of HubSpot? HubSpot is a CRM platform. It shares its data across every application, so every team can stay aligned. No out-of-sync spreadsheets or dueling databases. **HubSpot: Grow Better.**

Shaan Puri

Alright, I gotta tell you about one thing that's one of the great joys of my life. I'm not a cars guy, and I'm not a watch guy, but there's one thing that gives me a lot of joy, and that is having a virtual assistant. You know, here's the scenario: I'm running my companies, and even though I'm supposed to be this CEO, we all know I spend 20 to 30% of my time just doing random, tedious stuff that is not high value. It's just the stuff that has to get done, but it doesn't require my creativity, and it doesn't add a bunch of value to the business. It's just stuff that has to get done. So that stuff is what a virtual assistant does. Like, just this week alone, I lost my wallet. She goes to the DMV website, fills out a bunch of forms, and gets me a new license. Or, you know, every morning, while people have their morning coffee, I have my morning metrics. My morning metrics are basically all the business metrics that I care about compiled. She goes, finds it from all the different sources, puts it in an Excel sheet, takes a screenshot, and texts it to me. So that when I wake up in the morning, I don't go on Twitter or check my email; I'm looking at what the metrics are and what I need to do. I'm just focused on the right things. So having a virtual assistant is a no-brainer. Whether it's travel booking, managing your email inbox, or just knocking stuff off your personal to-do list that would have just lingered there forever, I think it's a no-brainer. If you're a business owner, you should definitely do it. I think one of the best places to find an assistant is Shepherd. So go to supportshepherd.com. You know, I pay my assistant, I think, $8 an hour, something like that. That's double what she was making in a previous job, so it's a win for her. For me, it's super affordable. It's something that you don't need to have the biggest business ever or be the biggest big shot in order to afford it. It's amazing! I now do this for my COO and my CMO too. I just give them assistance without them even asking because I know it makes them more productive. It does that for me, so of course, it's gonna do that for them too. So go to supportshepherd.com, check them out, get an assistant, and tell them I sent you. They'll take good care of you if you do that. So, supportshepherd.com, check it out.

Shaan Puri

And one of the things he did along the way was, "I really want to run this." I guess there's some hardcore race in Arizona or whatever—the hardest race.

Cody Ko

definitely or something like that

Shaan Puri

Something like that... He goes there and he sees people running, and then he sees this guy who's just like a huge guy running this race. He's by himself, and he's bleeding and running. It's David Goggins, essentially. He meets him and he's like, "Hey, I want to run this race next year. Will you train me?" And he's like, "Will you live in my house and train me for like 30 days?" And then he did. Years later, he wrote a book about that whole experience.

Cody Ko

oh that's cool

Shaan Puri

And this was before anyone knew who David Goggins was. So the book came out and he just calls it "living with a SEAL." He never mentions the guy's name, but he's like this character that's just... hard as shit. And just, you know, would wake him up... It'd be at 3 in the morning, they'd just like... they would run like 8 miles at night. Yeah, they'd wake him at 3 in the morning and be like, "Wake up, bitch! It's time!" You know? Like he'd be like, "Let's go, we're going running!" Again and again and again.

Cody Ko

I gotta read that

Shaan Puri

it's a great book it's a great read

Cody Ko

jesse itzel

Shaan Puri

Jesse Itzler's "Living with a SEAL" is a good one. Have you... for the running thing, is it like, why? I don't... I am like, if you told me to do an endurance thing, I'd be like, "Oh, you've suggested my least favorite activity on earth."

Cody Ko

yeah yeah

Shaan Puri

why do you do it

Cody Ko

My parents did it growing up, so it's kind of in my blood. I saw them do it, and I've always liked it. They raised us to go on bike trips all the time, so we were always doing it. Then we would see them do these incredible feats of fitness, and it just became something that drove me. I was an athlete in college and stuff, so when I graduated, I was like, "I need something to stay in shape." Running just seemed like the most natural thing. Once you do 3 miles, you're like, "I think I can do 5." Then you're like, "I should maybe go for a half marathon." You get kind of addicted to it, right? I've done marathons ever since. Then my sister signed up for an Ironman, and she did it. She's my younger sister, so I was like, "Damn it, she did that before me!" So then I signed up for one, and I did one. Now it just kind of... through that, I was going through a pretty dark...

Cody Ko

Right after COVID, and through training for these events, I did an ultra marathon first and then I did an Ironman. Through training for those, I kind of refound my confidence and my happiness. So now it's just something I want to make part of my life. I started the training channel, and now I'm just planning more things. I'm going to do the New York Marathon, and then I'm planning a 100-and-something mile ultra that I'm trying to do.

Shaan Puri

What about the music videos you guys do? Because they're amazing! They're almost like too amazing. It's like, wait, where did this come from? Why is this good? Are you guys... is this what you actually do? I didn't really understand the first time I saw one. I was like, "This is... I don't know." I was just very jealous. I was like, "Holy shit! You can't be like, 'Oh, I'm relatable and funny,' but I'm also like mega talented on the other side." So, you know, you get to pick. That's how life works. How did you guys start doing that? And why is it so, so fucking good? And why did you lean it up more if it's so good?

Cody Ko

I do think that, yeah, a lot of the stuff I've done or been successful at has been like... I'm the person to look at a pipe dream and be like, "It would be really cool to be that," and then actually try.

Shaan Puri

mhmm

Cody Ko

and so that's kinda how that started was

Shaan Puri

like you don't count yourself out you mean like

Cody Ko

Yeah, exactly. Somewhere in me, I kind of believe that I'm probably capable of that. I think everyone is capable of everything, but I'm pretty good at not turning myself down, I guess, at the beginning. That's kind of what I lost in that dark time. I lost that confidence. If I thought of something, I would revert back to, "No, you couldn't accomplish that." But when it came to music, I was always like, "It'd be cool to do it. It would be cool to go online and say I have a new song out." You know what I mean? That would be really...

Shaan Puri

cool thing backwards from that

Cody Ko

Yeah, exactly. I never played any instruments besides drums growing up. I was never really musically inclined, but I had a good sense of rhythm and I really enjoyed music. At first, I thought, "This is something that's not really for you." But then I was like, "No, why can't it be?" So, I downloaded FL Studio and made a beat. For one of our videos, I invited Noel over because he used to actually rap in high school. I said, "I made this beat; can you just rap over it? We'll make a funny song for the end of this video." He needed a little convincing because he was like, "I closed this chapter of my life." But I finally got him over to my place. He put a verse down, I recorded my verse, which I wrote and recorded, and then I tried to figure out how to process a voice.

Shaan Puri

which song is that

Cody Ko

This horrible song called "Keep Your Dick Fat," which is a comedy song... again, comedy.

Shaan Puri

is like

Cody Ko

again again like comedy is a nice crutch to lean on where you're like we're bad but it's funny

Shaan Puri

yeah exactly

Cody Ko

So, people don't like to put too much pressure on you or make fun of you too much. And so, we did that. Oh, that's still up? Wow, okay.

Shaan Puri

Gosh, it's my first beat ever. "Joe Bonny all day peanut butter." It's horrible. Yeah, I like the beginning stuff. I always like the really early stuff. How'd you decide on that as the concept? Like, what didn't make it that this one [did] as the idea?

Cody Ko

that's a great question actually I totally forget how we even came up with that

Shaan Puri

I think

Cody Ko

he must have said keep your dick fat or something and then I was like oh that's funny let's put that down

Shaan Puri

Well, that's also how Tiny Beat Gang came about, right? Like, that's it. It was just... yeah, he's absolutely saying that. It's just.

Cody Ko

Like, that was our whole thing. It's just **dick jokes** and being stupid, like we're 5 years old. So, after we released this, we shot a music video for it. We used a friend who was a DP, and we shot it all nice. Then we thought, "Oh, this is a fun thing," doing something with a little bit more high production value. This is like a really fun path to go down. Shortly after this, I got a DM from a producer in LA. His name's **Diamond Pistols**. Now, he's like a fantastic friend and has produced a ton of music for us. He was like, "Hey, I'm a producer. Let me produce your next song. This is really funny." So, we were like, "Sure!" We showed up at his place and we made a song called **Super Zen**.

Shaan Puri

like in a day or like

Cody Ko

we did we made that song in a day and

Shaan Puri

how do you make a song in a day what do you so you get there

Cody Ko

I mean, if you're working with a good producer, you get there and they're like, "What do you want to make?" You're like, "Hey, well, I've been listening..." Usually, the way a music session starts is you'll just listen to music together. You'll be like, "I've really been into this song recently." You'll put it on and try to find some sort of inspiration. Or if you come in with a concept, then you'll kind of work off that. We didn't really have anything, so he started making a beat. We just wrote some... let's say, "bullshit" lyrics, and then we came up with this concept. At that time, Xanax was like the big thing. Lil Pump and all these guys were talking about doing Xanax all the time. So we were like, "Let's make a song called 'Superzan' where it doesn't make any sense because we don't actually know what mainstream rap lyrics mean." We're just kind of trying to hang on to the trending references and stuff like that. Once we made that song, we thought, "This song is pretty damn good. Let's shoot another video for it." Noelle called in a bunch of favors, and we ended up getting a horse for this video.

Shaan Puri

these look expensive too so you guys like yeah this one was probably like you made a bet you're like $50 worth it

Cody Ko

yeah I mean music videos are

Shaan Puri

at the

Cody Ko

that's a money pit

Shaan Puri

at the time was that like kinda like significant like is that like a this was like a lot of money yes

Cody Ko

Oh yeah, it was... we had nothing back then, so it was huge. Like I said, a lot of people did it as favors because they liked us. That's Diamond Pistols, you know? A lot of people that were in the video, like she was a paid actress, but there were just friends and stuff. We knew someone who had a horse, and they brought the horse. We paid them like $500 or something.

Shaan Puri

wow

Cody Ko

So then we released this on Spotify, and it actually got a lot of streams because people watched the video; it was funny. So then we were like, "We should do an EP, maybe." We started making more music, and then fast forward to two EPs and albums later, we signed a music deal with Arista. We released two songs with them, one of them being "Broke Bitch," which now has over 50,000,000 streams. I think "Walkman" has like 80,000,000 or 90,000,000 streams.

Shaan Puri

yeah I think I saw one was like 85

Cody Ko

+ a million it's almost gold

Shaan Puri

is that a 100 a 100,000,000 gold

Cody Ko

It's just like it's $100,000 or it's $1,000,000 in sales, and I don't know how... I forget how this works.

Shaan Puri

that even work in sales

Cody Ko

Yeah, I forget. It's a weird equation, but I think it's almost certified gold, which is **fucking crazy**.

Shaan Puri

that's a funny wrap idea for you be like because because everyone's always a platinum

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

Yeah, it's like, "Yeah, we went gold!" Yeah, exactly. So, that's good. I like that.

Cody Ko

yeah I might steal that

Shaan Puri

Yeah, I'm funny too. Okay, one of my questions on my list was, "How do I... am I funny, and how do I get funnier?"

Cody Ko

so I would say yes

Shaan Puri

if you listen to the pod go ahead

Cody Ko

Yeah, I would say you're definitely funny. I chuckle... I think you guys... Here, I'll give you some constructive criticism from a listener, from a fan of the show: I think you need better cold opens.

Shaan Puri

agreed

Cody Ko

A lot of times, I feel like you use the wrong moments. You should use the funnier moments, maybe.

Shaan Puri

It's even dumber than that. We come from a different world, so it's like we're just dumb about how you would do a creative process. It's like: "Oh, you should care about this and you should run a process that looks at the feedback or the data and then makes it better." Yeah, or like watch it together and be like, "What could we do better?"

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

we've never done that

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

but we should

Cody Ko

Yeah, I mean, I don't know. The show's good, so that's like... that's my only little thing. Because it's such a great opportunity for a laugh right before the smash cut to the intro. It's such a beautiful thing. And so we tend to take our cold opens pretty seriously. We're like, "We need a good laugh right at the beginning of the show." [We want] someone [to turn] it on and they're like, "I knew I liked this show!"

Shaan Puri

another week you know

Cody Ko

I'm sticking around one more week

Shaan Puri

I'll stay till we add real yeah exactly

Cody Ko

I'll stick around for 10 minutes exactly

Shaan Puri

the I just saw on the ideas so I have an idea section for you where I was gonna pitch you / oh

Cody Ko

yeah okay

Shaan Puri

we had one before you walked in

Cody Ko

frozen s'mores

Shaan Puri

yeah I was like why isn't there something called frozen s'mores

Cody Ko

so why me though

Shaan Puri

Well, we had the idea right before you arrived, and I was like, "I gotta ask Cody about frozen s'mores potential." Do you think there's potential there?

Cody Ko

listen I like

Shaan Puri

So, what we're gonna do here... Let me tell you how this came about, okay? I was like in the studio or whatever, and I was like, "I want..." Because this might look however it looks, but we're in an office building and this is like a small cubicle of an office when we're here. I was like, "I wanna buy an ice cream truck and turn it into a podcast studio and like roll it up to wherever we're gonna... whoever I wanna record with and like do that."

Cody Ko

that's what steve o does

Shaan Puri

I think an ice cream truck

Cody Ko

it's not in an ice cream truck but he has like a sprinter van right that he's turned into a little I

Shaan Puri

was worried that no I I I'm not that

Cody Ko

My dude is cool. Having a traveling set is great because he pulled up right outside my house, and I literally had a commute of 2 seconds.

Shaan Puri

that's what I wanna do

Cody Ko

yeah it was pretty sick

Shaan Puri

And so we're like, "Oh, let's retrofit it." Then Ben was like, "You know, we gotta just create an ice cream brand if we're gonna do that."

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

Frozen s'mores. Yeah, okay, okay, it's a s'more. I see the... yeah, cold, and the marshmallow's vanilla ice cream. Okay, that's idea number one I have for you.

Cody Ko

that's good I like that yeah marshmallows are my least favorite thing about s'mores

Shaan Puri

So, agreed. Agreed. Okay, next one: let's make a Netflix show. I wanted to brainstorm with...

Cody Ko

you

Shaan Puri

Real quick, a Netflix show that's business-related. So, business unscripted—that's the category. Shark Tank is a great show.

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

We need more... So, you know the way *American Idol* happened, and then people were like, "Oh shit, *The Voice*, *X Factor*, *America's Got Talent*"? Like, people just took that format and started remixing it. [They realized] "People like this amateur singing thing, we're gonna do [more of] that."

Cody Ko

it yeah

Shaan Puri

I think people like the amateur business thing

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

shark tank works

Cody Ko

yep

Shaan Puri

There's not really another *Shark Tank*. There's not like another remixed version of a cool thing that you would want. If you like *Shark Tank*, you might like this.

Cody Ko

so we could do one for like creators

Shaan Puri

so I don't know just like what would what would work what do you think

Cody Ko

I like the idea of doing it where people like come in and pitch their channel or their like tiktok

Shaan Puri

yeah

Cody Ko

idea or whatever

Shaan Puri

this was sully's idea last night

Shaan Puri

he's like yeah we need it for creators yeah

Cody Ko

that's good

Shaan Puri

I think I've

Cody Ko

I heard someone doing that. I think because I've... that's not the first time I've heard that idea. But I think it's an awesome idea.

Shaan Puri

So, how would it work? They come in, you've got you as a guest, just like successful creators maybe, or like judges or whatever. What do they get? Because, you know, in the business thing you're like, "I get the investment." What are the... yeah, what are the... I get the investment, I'm gonna get... No, no, no. What would the judges get? What does the contestant get? Like, what do they want? To create their channel?

Cody Ko

every creator just needs money to fund their idea

Shaan Puri

I see and so that's awesome I guess

Cody Ko

And then you'd maybe, like, as a judge, you'd be like, "Okay, now I get 10% of everything that you make. I'm your manager now."

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

in the future that's a good idea

Shaan Puri

okay you're in I I it

Cody Ko

sounds like

Shaan Puri

it sounds like you're in

Cody Ko

it sound I'm in on both so far okay cool so we're doing all of these

Shaan Puri

yeah frozen s'mores first clearly yeah 2nd shark tank for for creators

Cody Ko

yep

Shaan Puri

Another one: app startup ideas. Okay, so, "Cap That." Yep, smash it! Yeah, "Cap That" + true smash hit.

Cody Ko

I cap that 2 smash hit

Shaan Puri

smash hit

Cody Ko

I cap that 2 + where did

Shaan Puri

it stop

Cody Ko

less hit

Shaan Puri

was it 2 + where it ended

Cody Ko

it is that's when traction started dying a little bit

Shaan Puri

Have you had any... and you were almost... I say almost because I think your friend, best friend, something like that, started Cameo. So you were like very close also to creating Cameo, yeah, or being a part of Cameo?

Cody Ko

Oh yeah, I could have been in at the beginning. They were making that in my living room, and I was like, "This is... you're like..."

Shaan Puri

losers I was like cool

Cody Ko

yeah it looks cool

Shaan Puri

look what

Cody Ko

Are these guys doing? Then I go record a YouTube video like that's any cooler. And then it blew the fuck up. I ended up investing in Series A, right?

Shaan Puri

and I

Cody Ko

was like these guys were building this beside me

Shaan Puri

Well, good for you! Because anytime I miss the first round, it kills me to come in later. Even though, like, you should just come in, it's like, "Yeah, yeah." And I'm like so anchored... yeah. And you're like, "No," to the fact that they were in my living room.

Cody Ko

it's out of the principle

Shaan Puri

yeah yeah I will lose more

Cody Ko

yeah yeah exactly

Shaan Puri

So, have you had any other viral app ideas that you haven't pursued because you're busy being, like, one famous?

Cody Ko

It was like an app where you could figure out where to buy frozen s'mores.

Shaan Puri

frozen s'more locator

Cody Ko

Yes, exactly. But then I was like, "Wait, that doesn't exist yet." So someone has to invent that, and then I'm going to make that happen.

Shaan Puri

That's good. Do you have any problems, pain points, or opportunities you've seen? As a creator, there are tons of companies in Silicon Valley that say, "We serve the creator economy."

Cody Ko

yeah

Shaan Puri

But I don't think they really know or understand how a creator's lifestyle is. What do they actually want? Have you seen any pain points or opportunities that you think someone who's business-minded would pursue?

Cody Ko

I think AI has kind of revolutionized everything. But I think there's a lot of potential there to help creators, whether it's with something as simple as a thumbnail or a title.

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

like I've noticed people using ai to make their thumbnails stand out in crazy ass ways

Shaan Puri

what do they even use for that like what do what do they what do they use I don't know but a lot

Cody Ko

Of times, like they'll just make it look a little bit cartoony, but then they'll blend it with the original thumbnail so that it's...

Shaan Puri

not gotcha

Cody Ko

Obvious, but it's eye-catching. You're like, "Something's weird about that thumbnail," which is what it takes to stand out. People think that a good thumbnail is about contrast and colors, but a lot of times that ends up blending in.

Shaan Puri

right

Cody Ko

you just wanna look different so I think ai does that

Shaan Puri

I remember, like, in history class at Duke, I actually learned that Hitler did that. So, back in the day, you and Hitler...

Cody Ko

okay yeah like yeah wow

Shaan Puri

Like minds think alike. All the posters were colored, just like print. Everybody was using color, and so all of his marketing was done in black and white—black and white flyers, posters, whatever.

Cody Ko

yeah because

Shaan Puri

it was just a contrast yeah to everything else yeah and it was like yeah so there you go

Cody Ko

take a page out of hitler's book you know what you think about thumbnails but I think

Shaan Puri

hold up got it yeah exactly yeah exactly I'm learning I'm learning

Cody Ko

But yeah, I think there's other stuff. For example, with podcasting, I know there's so much with ads that you can do. The most obvious to me being, you know, training some AI on how we speak. Just feeding it the transcript of our 500 episodes, right? Then, having it write the ads for us in our own voice and actually synthesizing our voices to read the ads for us. This way, we don't actually have to record anything, right? Eventually, just doing the whole podcast. But like the ad thing, I think is so obvious. It should happen right away, and if it's not already being worked on, it should be.

Shaan Puri

Have you had anybody send you a link to, like, "Here's you doing the podcast" or "Here's you doing the ad"? Yeah, it's kind of...

Cody Ko

Amazing! Did it last time? It was like... I forget the company's name, but I think they were looking for investment. I think I didn't reply to the first email, so in the second one, they're like, "Here, by the way, here's your voice." It was an app where you could call Elon, for example, and have a conversation with him right on your computer speaker, basically. So, we called me on the podcast, and both of us just talked. It was so fucking scary... wow, and weird.

Shaan Puri

you're like he's this guy's great yeah

Cody Ko

Yeah, exactly. This guy's funny. I was like, "Our job is over, right? We're not going to have this job in a year."

Shaan Puri

you met elon right you what was it you went to

Cody Ko

went to his house you went

Shaan Puri

to his house

Cody Ko

I partied with him one time

Shaan Puri

how was it tell me everything how does that even happen

Cody Ko

We were... this is the first time I ever met Post Malone. We're like, you know, good friends. I wouldn't say that as a flex; I'm just like, I *fucking* love the guy. Whenever he hits me up, I'm down to hang out. But the first time he DMs me, which...

Shaan Puri

is often

Cody Ko

He's not often... he's a fucking rockstar. So, it's like I don't hear from him for 8 months, and then all of a sudden he'll text me. He's like, "I'm in town," and then we're like, "Fuck yeah, let's hang!" But he hit us up on Twitter, and Noel, I think, was like, "Hey, hey Dad," or something like that, "I love your videos," or something. I was like, "Oh my God, I was a huge fan of his music!" So, I was like, thrilled. Then he was like, "I'm flying back from Australia in 3 days or something like that. Let's get drinks." I was like, "Let's do it!" I think I was with Kelsey's family at the time, my wife, at a family dinner or something. He was like, "I'm back in town. Let's meet at the Rainbow Room in, you know, an hour." I was like, "Alright guys, I gotta go. Sorry, Kelsey's family, I gotta dip out." So, we went and met up with him at the Rainbow Room, and we got fucked up. We were drinking, you know, lemon drops, and it was just like this surreal experience where we were just like... 'cause he's very similar. He has the same sense of humor, so we were just joking around, riffing, having a great time. Then he looks at his phone and he's like, "Elon... Elon's been texting me." And we're like, "Yeah, sure, totally," just thinking it was a joke. Then he showed us his phone, and it was...

Shaan Puri

like elon musk he was like come over and we were like

Cody Ko

and he was like oh no

Shaan Puri

he was like should we go over

Cody Ko

To this house, and we were like, "Yeah, I mean, you can't really say no to that."

Shaan Puri

yeah

Cody Ko

And so we got in cars and drove to his house. When we arrived, he and Grimes were standing on the driveway with lanterns, welcoming us.

Shaan Puri

why my house is that like

Cody Ko

I don't know. It was... it was so bizarre. The whole thing was from a dream. I swear to God, it was the weirdest night of all time.

Shaan Puri

was it like a 1000 people there or it's like just y'all

Cody Ko

No, it was like 10 or not even. It was like Post Malone, Elon Musk, and us—these like, you know, hangers-on. It was like, "Hi, include me," and then it was Elon and Grimes. I forget who else was there, a couple of producers and like two other people. So we're all sitting around the fire, and it's like 2 or 3 in the morning. We're just sitting there talking, and Post and Elon are talking. He's nursing a glass of whiskey or something like that. I remember thinking, "This house doesn't have any furniture. It's really weird." Someone was like, "Well, this is his pie party house. His family house is across the street or something." I was like, "Oh, that makes sense." Right? A billionaire. That's cool. Yeah, exactly. I would have a party.

Shaan Puri

I was

Cody Ko

like I could have one

Shaan Puri

with no furniture

Cody Ko

yeah and so eventually and then and then so you're all standing

Shaan Puri

what so you're all standing basically no no

Cody Ko

no we're sitting outside of a outside like around a fire pit like on some ledge or something like that

Shaan Puri

I think

Cody Ko

There were like a couple of chairs; they were very sporadic. Then I remember, like, we finally... it was like 4 AM. I was like, "Okay, I gotta go home. Kelsey's asking where I'm at." So we go downstairs and can't figure out which door leads out. I was like, "I don't wanna open a random door and then there's like a spaceship in there."

Shaan Puri

quick there's not enough time get on

Cody Ko

So then I go back upstairs and I lean around the corner, and Elon and Grimes are making out.

Shaan Puri

and I was like hey

Cody Ko

I'm not gonna interrupt that. So then we just went downstairs, found the door, and then we were sitting—both of us, me and Noel—on the curb afterwards, looking up, just like, "What the fuck? No one's gonna believe this." Like, this is the wildest night we've ever had. It was crazy.

Shaan Puri

that's insane what's he like

Cody Ko

he he was nice yeah he was nice I was pretty drunk so what

Shaan Puri

what does one talk about

Cody Ko

My memory is a little foggy, but I remember him saying some things that were like, "Okay, he clearly thinks a little bit differently about things."

Shaan Puri

What did you... are you like in that moment? Because whenever I meet celebrities, I make a complete ass out of myself. I don't want to go and I don't want to meet them. I mean, I don't want to do it. You know, I start thinking stupid things and I say stupid things.

Cody Ko

I think it was one of those things where we were not invited. It was like Post that was invited, so he really wanted to get to know Post. They were talking, and we were sitting beside them, just kind of going, "Yeah, so... yeah." I mean, I totally agree. We were trying to not be a nuisance, right?

Shaan Puri

that's a better mentality that's yeah that's my new mentality with celebrities

Cody Ko

just be there

Shaan Puri

not be a nuisance

Cody Ko

And don't... yeah, don't get people to wish you weren't there, you know?

Shaan Puri

that's the new win

Cody Ko

yeah exactly

Shaan Puri

yeah because my win is like we're we're best friends after this so what I need to do is

Cody Ko

just harm the piss off this guy no yeah I was too scared honestly

Shaan Puri

that's hilarious dude this was fun thanks for coming on yes that's great thanks for doing that

Cody Ko

thanks for having me appreciate it cool

Shaan Puri

bye nice to meet you