How Dave Ramsey Built A $300M/Year Media Empire (#428)
Superfood failures, Dave Ramsey's empire, trademark importance. - March 9, 2023 (about 2 years ago) • 01:00:18
Transcript:
| Start Time | Speaker | Text |
|---|---|---|
Shaan Puri | Dave's back and dave's back in a big way | |
Sam Parr | in a big | |
Shaan Puri | Here are some things that Dave has said. He claims he has a **$600,000,000** real estate portfolio that is fully paid off. So, **$600,000,000** of real estate equity that he owns—that's kind of insane!
His media empire, which includes his radio shows and all of the financial courses, training, seminars, and other activities they do outside of that, reportedly makes **$300,000,000** a year in revenue according to their website.
| |
Sam Parr | alright we're live | |
Shaan Puri | so what do you wanna talk about today | |
Sam Parr | I've got a bunch of good topics. Let me bring up one juicy one. Last year, or maybe it was 2 years ago, you asked me a question. You were like, "Who do you admire?" I think you asked me that, and I said this guy named **Laird Hamilton**.
Laird Hamilton is this beautiful surfer dude. He's in his fifties now, basically. He's beautiful. We have to acknowledge that he has beautiful wavy blonde hair, nice skin, and he's pretty ripped for his age. He always was ripped. He's like this tough guy that surfs big waves and whatever.
He launched this thing called... what? You make fun of me because I'm dreaming about this guy. This is...
| |
Shaan Puri | not I don't even need to make a joke you've you've done it all yourself here he's a ken dao | |
Sam Parr |
Like... this is objective. I'm just stating facts here. He's a human Ken doll. He launched this thing called Layered Superfoods. Have you heard of that? It's like a coffee creamer that's made out of coconut, I think.
| |
Shaan Puri | right | |
Sam Parr |
Anyway, they took the company public. I don't know why they did that... wow. But they took it public at a $300 or $400 million market cap. At the time, they were doing $50 million in revenue. Look up the company now. Can you go and look up... do you know what their market cap is today?
| |
Shaan Puri | let me find it | |
Sam Parr | I know what it was yesterday I don't know what it is today | |
Shaan Puri | why would it be so different oh wow $9,000,000 | |
Sam Parr | $9,000,000. So, this company... if you click, I have a bunch of notes here. You can click them and read them. But basically, this company sells a fair amount of coffee creamers.
So yesterday, I think it was $8,800,000. Dude, listen. They have $20,000,000 in cash and no debt at all. Their revenue is decreasing. In Q3, it was $8,800,000, and in Q3 of last year, it was $10,900,000. So what's that? Like a... like a 4 times 8? So it's a $48,000,000 or $50,000,000 a year business, but it's declining.
They have decent gross profit and an okay balance sheet, but for some reason, the business is valued so low. I'd have to dive deep into it and really look at the numbers, but it's kind of ridiculous, right?
So you were talking about wanting to buy a company. You've said this before. This is your target, dude. You get to hang out with Laird Hamilton.
| |
Shaan Puri | Like, it's your target, dude. This sounds like one of those things where it's like, "We're auctioning off a date with Laird Hamilton." It's like...
| |
Sam Parr | a hug | |
Shaan Puri | why why don't you buy this yeah you you just bought yourself a $9,000,000 hug | |
Sam Parr | dude why is this why is this company you haven't looked at this but why is this company so cheap | |
Shaan Puri | no I don't know what I mean I don't know how much debt they have but none | |
Sam Parr | I said that the so I read their report they had their q three report | |
Shaan Puri | so I never understand that | |
Sam Parr | $21,000,000 in cash 0 debt 0 debt | |
Shaan Puri |
So I never understand when companies trade this far below their just cash value. Because, you know, the obvious question then is:
**Why do you not buy this thing for $15 million and just wind it down and distribute the $20 million to yourself and make $5 million?**
You know, like in the... [unfinished thought]
| |
Sam Parr | sell the inventory they have like 13,000,000 or something in inventory | |
Shaan Puri |
Okay, interesting. So yeah, I haven't looked at this because you just mentioned it, but there's a bunch of these right now that are like this. There was one the other day that I saw that was kind of in the same bucket. But there's a bunch of stocks that are down like 95% right now that seem like... you know, interesting takeover targets.
We have a friend who was interested in doing this, and so I made a list of like 10. I was like, "Here's 10 that I think you could buy."
| |
Sam Parr | is this friend aggressive | |
Shaan Puri | it's an aggressive friend | |
Sam Parr | got it I know who you okay I know which friend it is | |
Shaan Puri | How tight is that, by the way? Just to be able to say, "This is an aggressive friend," and you're like, "Yeah, I know who it is." Does this friend... would...? | |
Sam Parr | This friend said to a bottling entrepreneur, "Your business is one Google away from me ruining you."
| |
Shaan Puri |
No, I don't think so, but maybe... They usually don't say things to their faces like that. They're more just like an under... you know those sharks that swim only under the water? They don't put the fin out. He's more like that.
| |
Sam Parr | got it | |
Shaan Puri |
Okay, but Wish.com was the other example that I had recently seen that was like this. Wish, you know, [is a] pretty big brand name because they spent billions of dollars marketing this thing.
| |
Sam Parr | $10,000,000,000 market cap at one. | |
Shaan Puri | Now, $360,000,000. So, $10,000,000,000 to $360,000,000 has $700,000,000 in cash with no liabilities. You know, I don't know exactly how you could buy these things. I think that's the challenge: to actually acquire the majority. In doing so, you would push the price up because people would know what you're doing.
So, I think you'd have to make a tender offer at a specific price that's, you know, something above. But, you know, the board will just reject it. They'll say, "We have more cash than that on the balance sheet, so we don't need to sell at this price."
I don't know exactly how somebody does this mechanically. I don't know if this is like, you know, fantasy math where you're like, "Dude, what if Shaq was in the 100-meter race? You could just knock people over." It's like, dude, that's not it. It doesn't make sense.
| |
Sam Parr | how things work in | |
Shaan Puri | In the real world, this idea of public company takeovers is not something that I understand, you know.
| |
Sam Parr | is that like a drunken conversation you've had which is can check on the 100 meter - | |
Shaan Puri |
You know, the one thing about this podcast is the number of on-the-fly analogies you have to create. It's... that's a different skill, that's a different muscle. And yeah, that muscle's not so strong yet. Still working on it.
| |
Sam Parr |
So anyway, Laird Superfood... interesting company that I was eyeing. Laird maybe a little less hot in my book now because his company is worth only $8 million as opposed to $300 million. Now he's just a really hot, fit guy. Before, he was hot, fit, *and* rich, so...
| |
Shaan Puri | he lost the 3rd leg of the stool | |
Sam Parr | Yeah, he's still famous. Trump's wealth is, in most cases, in most people's eyes... but anyway.
| |
Shaan Puri |
Alright, well let me tell you... let me tell you about somebody who is rich and somebody who is famous, but he's not hot. Woof! Can I tell you who this is? Okay, are you familiar with Dave Ramsey?
| |
Sam Parr | yeah yeah yeah yeah very | |
Shaan Puri | tell me what you know about dave ramsey and I'm gonna fill in some gaps for you | |
Sam Parr | So, Dave, he's like a personal finance guru. He's based out of Franklin, Tennessee, and he's probably in his seventies now. He started as a radio host with the "Dave Ramsey Show," and then he parlayed that into the Dave Ramsey Network.
Now, he has around 400 to 500 employees based out of Franklin, Tennessee, and they generate about $400 to $500 million a year in revenue by selling personal finance products. A lot of his ideas are considered pretty controversial because many of his personal finance rules are based on biblical principles. He also believes in having zero debt and is quite conservative, so people who aren't conservative tend not to be into him.
| |
Shaan Puri |
Okay, well you do a lot more than I would have thought. So dude, I'm from... I live here, I guess the segment's over... like Franklin, Tennessee. How do you know this stuff? What's going on here?
| |
Sam Parr | He also bought all of his buildings without any debt. So, he owns like a campus in Franklin, Tennessee.
| |
Shaan Puri | Yeah, so I decided... but did I? I don't know. Well, you spit in my food, but alright, I'm still hungry, so let's go.
So, Dave, he's 62 years old. He was a realtor turned radio host, and yeah, he's from Tennessee.
So basically, what happened is by his mid-twenties... this is like back in the eighties.
| |
Sam Parr | eighties you didn't know who dolly parton was and she's also a tennessee person so like | |
Shaan Puri | Yeah, I guess I learned my lesson. I'm not coming at you with any Tennessee trivia anymore; you're a ringer for that stuff.
So, by his mid-twenties, he's got like a $4,000,000 real estate portfolio, and it's kicking off some cash—maybe like a 5% cash-on-cash return. So, he's making $250,000 a year off his real estate portfolio at that stage, in 1988.
At that time, the year I was born, his bank basically revokes his line of credit and demands that he pays it back. He couldn't sell fast enough, so he gets foreclosed on and declares bankruptcy. This is like the trauma of why he's like, "Don't choose debt. No debt."
Yeah, and he's like, "Debt bad. Debt bad." Why? Because I burned my hand on the debt stove before this. So, he's got no money now, his marriage is on the rocks, and he says he's considering committing suicide. But, you know, he gets back on his feet.
So, this is kind of like his story. Anyway, fast forward to today—Dave's back, and Dave's back in a big way. | |
Sam Parr | in a big way | |
Shaan Puri |
Here are some things that Dave has said:
He claims to have a **$600 million real estate portfolio** that is fully paid off. That's $600 million of real estate equity that he owns, which is kind of insane.
His media empire, which is the combination of:
- His radio shows
- All of the financial courses, training seminars, and other related offerings
According to their website, this media empire generates **$300 million a year in revenue**, separate from his real estate holdings.
| |
Sam Parr | I believe it which is absurd | |
Shaan Puri | I you don't know any people | |
Sam Parr | that go to that | |
Shaan Puri | what's that no I have no people anybody that goes to | |
Sam Parr |
So, dude, in the South it's a thing. I had Texas employees, and like, if you're just a normal couple where each employee - or each wife and husband - makes like $60,000 or $70,000 a year, you'll pay to go to a Dave Ramsey [financial seminar]. He trains these financial advisers and they host seminars. You'll go to this like 5-day weeknights thing where, instead of Bible study, it's like... we teach you how to save and invest, I guess.
| |
Shaan Puri | It's like Jesus on the front and a P&L on the back. It's like this new remix Bible. I love it!
His company, Ramsey Solutions, is just an absolute juggernaut. It's insane.
So, okay, let's break down the media side. He launched this thing in 1992 and basically he's done content for 30 years about the same 7 steps. It's like this guy's just been talking about the same thing. I don't know how he feels; I've never listened to a full thing, but I don't know, he feels like he does 4 hours a day of radio.
| |
Sam Parr | it's a good show | |
Shaan Puri | Just saying the same thing every time, like, "Oh, you got debt? Pay that off." Right? So he's got these seven tenets.
Here are his seven tenets:
1. **Establish an emergency fund of $1,000.** That's your first baby step to financial freedom.
2. **Pay off all your non-housing debts ASAP,** starting with the smallest one. He calls this a "snowball." So don't pay off the highest interest rate debt first; just pay off the smallest thing you can to get momentum. I like that.
3. **Increase your emergency fund to 3 to 6 months of income.**
4. **Put 15% into a 401(k) or IRA.**
5. **Start your 529 plans** or whatever for college funds.
6. **Pay off your mortgage.**
7. Now you're fully paid off, you've got your safety net, and you can start to build wealth.
So those are his seven steps. His company, Ramsey Solutions, is a biblically-based, common-sense financial education media company. Not gonna lie, that's a bar.
| |
Sam Parr | that's a bar | |
Shaan Puri | Absolute bar! Like, you know, the... I was like, "Hey, YouTube editor, play that clip of Jay-Z the first time he hears the intro." You know, the Timbaland's playing him a beat and he's like, "Oh, that's nice." That's how I feel when I hear the biblically based common sense financial education media company.
So that's amazing. Then, you've got... you talked about this like his Tennessee empire. He's got 1,000 employees working there. He owns all the real estate. So, I don't know if this is correct; the researcher might have just gone off the rails.
| |
Sam Parr | dude he owns a lot he owns a lot | |
Shaan Puri | He owns two office towers that are 200,000 square feet. That sounds absurd. I don't know.
| |
Sam Parr | that's I don't that that's too much | |
Shaan Puri | Not real, you know? We gotta get the researcher. You know, stop drinking your product that you were selling from college. Yeah, strike one.
But he's got basically like a **50,000 square foot** event center. He's got **60 acres** of property that he bought for **$10,000,000**. So, he owns a bunch of land and uses that land to run his kind of like, you know, common sense biblical financial empire out in Tennessee.
He's doing his show for **3 hours a day**, **5 days a week**. People call in and they're basically like, "Alright, Dave, you know, long-time listener, first-time caller."
And you know, there's part of it that's sort of like my first million. I actually think we should steal his shtick, which is he goes like... they'll call and they'll be like, "I'm worth **$4,000,000**." And he'll be like, "How old are you?" They'll say, "I'm **32 years old**." And he'll respond, "Fantastic, **34,000,000**."
He's writing notes this whole time, and then he'll be like, "How much debt?" And they'll be like, "Yeah, I got my mortgage, you know, **$800,000**." You could just hear him like sit somewhere with a little tsk, you know? It's like dad's disappointed in me.
Then he'd be like, "You know, I'll make this much a year, I put this much away," and blah, blah, blah. Then he gives them financial advice, which is kind of the same financial advice every single time. But somehow, people really get into this thing.
Then the other things he does, which are just these hilarious segments, are... he's got "Everyday Millionaires." So, somebody calls in, he interviews someone that's worth **$1,000,000**. But then he has, and this is good, the "Debt Free Scream." Have you seen this before?
| |
Sam Parr | Well, I used to think that it was like the equivalent of ringing a bell. He had a thing where people would call and say, "I finally paid off my debt," and they would celebrate it.
| |
Shaan Puri |
They celebrate it with the "debt-free scream." I think there are things we could learn from this guy. I think we should steal some of this guy's shtick. He's really got something going here. Anyway, so you wait...
| |
Sam Parr | you've never heard of him | |
Shaan Puri | No, no, I've heard of him. I didn't realize how rich he was. I just thought he was like someone's dad that gives basic financial advice because it's...
| |
Sam Parr | he's got the dad vibe he he's got the vibe of someone who calls diabetes diabetes | |
Shaan Puri | like that's the you know what I mean like like the thing above your head | |
Sam Parr | is definitely a rough to him not a roof | |
Shaan Puri |
He's got that type of 100% on the diabetes thing, dude. Yeah, so good. Vibe end the podcast. It's too good! I need to now laugh for 30 minutes. I don't wanna do the rest of the podcast. That's... that's his vibe.
| |
Sam Parr | he's a little judgmental too and he's like this is the only way | |
Shaan Puri | yeah he's got opinionated I mean he's doctor phil for money he's | |
Sam Parr | you know exactly | |
Shaan Puri | you know he he's got his thing which is like this is how you do things and | |
Sam Parr | he's like a guy with the big belly who wears suspenders vibes you know what I'm | |
Shaan Puri | talking about like like that like | |
Sam Parr | that type of vibe so he's not wrong it's just sometimes his energy I think is a little bit judgmental | |
Shaan Puri | Yeah, exactly. Okay, I was going to make a bunch of jokes about his look, but I decided to turn the other cheek or whatever he would want me to do.
His show is like nationally syndicated on radio, which I think is like the hack. Apparently, 20 million people a week listen to this. I don't know how, but it's huge.
| |
Sam Parr | basically drive | |
Shaan Puri | I would | |
Sam Parr | listen to it all the time | |
Shaan Puri |
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course you did. Of course you're his target market.
So, you know, he's basically carried by like 600 radio affiliates. I think that's amazing. He's got his books... he's got 23 best-selling books. I don't know what that even means. That's like their... that's their [claim].
| |
Sam Parr | think that means | |
Shaan Puri | That's their personality. So, he's got like his daughter who does it now, and he's got these other people like Ken and Doctor John, and all these other people that he's created as other kinds of personalities or brands. They're called the Ramsey personalities.
So, he's got the man... anyways, live speaking courses, they got an app, they have all kinds of stuff. It's kind of crazy.
So, let me give you some of his tweets. Some of his tweets are quotes. I want you to react to them with a "Hallelujah!" or a "No, brother, not for me."
Alright, so the first one: "If you're working and paying off debt, the only time you should see the inside of a restaurant is if you're working there."
| |
Sam Parr | yeah hallelujah | |
Shaan Puri | I'll I'll give you that a halfhearted hallelujah | |
Sam Parr | that's fine | |
Shaan Puri | if you come to work late and they're paying you you're stealing don't steal and expect to be promoted | |
Sam Parr | hallelujah | |
Shaan Puri | I'm a capitalist pig. There's nothing socialist about me. I'd put my receptionist on straight commission if I could figure out a way. | |
Sam Parr | 100% hallelujah | |
Shaan Puri | Love that one! Alright, Dave, now you're talking my style.
Alright, here we go. If somebody calls in and they have more debt than their annual income, he'll say, "That's a small shovel in a big hole." I love that! Love that, Dave. Fantastic!
Okay, then he also quotes Proverbs 22:7 and states, "The rich rule over the poor, and the borrower is a slave to the lender."
| |
Sam Parr | No, I think that that's wrong. I believe that you can use debt effectively to help you, sure. | |
Shaan Puri |
The guy's awesome! And I did not... he carries a gun. He carries a .45 with hollow-point bullets, according to himself.
| |
Sam Parr | you know what a 45 is that's a pretty big round | |
Shaan Puri | yeah that's the biggest round I know of | |
Sam Parr | that's a big that that's a big round | |
Shaan Puri |
Yeah, so anyways... fascinating guy in his sixties that I could not believe. His empire generates this much cash. $300,000,000 a year is a pretty absurd number for them.
| |
Sam Parr | dude and he's been doing that for decades | |
Shaan Puri | It just shows you how big the Tony Robbins empire must be. Tony Robbins says this during his events: "My business is bringing over $500,000,000 a year."
But I didn't know what that means because, like, when an ad agency guy says, "I've spent over $100,000,000," you know, it's like, "No dude, you took a budget from the company, you pushed spend, you had the average normal rate, and you've done this for 10 years. You just added up their total revenue number." That's not you.
Or, you know, a lot of people will say they own $100,000,000 of real estate. And I'm like, "Okay, cool. So what's your equity in that?" They're like, "Well, it's 80% bank loans, so the bank owns 80% of it. And then of the 20% down, I syndicated that out, so I got a 3% broker commission on it, and I own 2% of the property."
It's like, "Okay, let's be a little more real about it."
So to me, it was pretty stunning to hear that he's got a $600,000,000 fully paid-off real estate portfolio and a $300,000,000 a year business. If those numbers are to be believed, I can also see this being totally full of shit, by the way. No, no, no, no, no.
| |
Sam Parr | It's not full of shit. It's definitely not full of shit. I don't have any way to verify it, but I know his reach, and I know that that is very attainable.
| |
Shaan Puri | to god yeah dude did you just read a book | |
Sam Parr | of of words christians say | |
Shaan Puri |
No dude, it's the flooding. I... I just have a little special something in me today. Yeah, either I'm gonna get canceled or I'm gonna get a good laugh out of you, and that is worth the risk to me. Have you...
| |
Sam Parr | been south of the mason dixon line man have you like been in the midwest what | |
Shaan Puri | just the mason dixon line apparently not you went | |
Sam Parr | to duke but duke's not really the south the main yeah | |
Shaan Puri | I don't think my skin color's allowed south of the mason dixon line I don't know what that is | |
Sam Parr | Have you hung out in places like Tennessee, Missouri, Kansas, or Alabama? You've never hung out in any of these places, have you?
| |
Shaan Puri |
"Hung out?" Is there something to do there? Have you ever even been?
I drove through when I came to California. I had to step through the mud of the Midwest to get here.
Dude, you gotta go, man!
| |
Sam Parr | you're so out of tulsa | |
Shaan Puri | Oklahoma. All jokes aside, you know I got my... that's like an unlikely southern street cred, dude. That's like a very **bird** certificate.
| |
Sam Parr | Just because you've been to the airport doesn't mean you've been there. That's like with this type of thing. You gotta get out, man. Even just go to... this sounds very...
| |
Shaan Puri | ass get out is right if you're in tennessee you do gotta get out dude just go exactly | |
Sam Parr |
You're gonna drive an hour and a half north and go to a Walmart and just chill. Just watch what people purchase and watch what they buy. You gotta get out of your little San Francisco bubble, my man. You gotta get out and see... like, there's 350,000,000 people in America.
| |
Shaan Puri |
This is... I gotta tell you a funny story. Yesterday, I went to go... I left my house for a meeting. So I go meet somebody very interesting. I might tell you about this later in the pod.
So I go meet somebody very interesting, and for who... I'll... I'm deciding if I wanna save it to do a bigger thing, or he's gonna come on as a guest, or maybe I'll tell you about it. I haven't decided yet.
[Other person asks: "Do I know them?"]
No, I don't think... because they're not in your world, right? Like, you know about Dolly Parton, you don't know about... like, you know, the NBA. You know, so it's like a different... different [world].
| |
Sam Parr | yeah not a big baseball guy | |
Shaan Puri | So, I brought my wife and kids with me. It was kind of a long drive, and I thought, "Why don't we all drive down there together?" You know, the nanny is out sick, so we decided to drive together.
We'll go to McDonald's afterwards because my kids love getting a Happy Meal toy. There's nothing around us, so we thought it would be a good idea to go out there.
We drove an hour away to this McDonald's, and I'm waiting in what I think is the line. But you know, McDonald's can be kind of ambiguous with the line. They don't have a clear setup like at the airport.
| |
Sam Parr | order at the checkout or you have the self checkout too | |
Shaan Puri | No, there are self-checkouts to the left and the right, and then there's the cashier in the front. There are some people just waiting for their order. You don't know if they're in line or not; you don't know what's going on.
So, there's a guy in front of me, and the cashier is just waiting. I said, "Oh, you can go; she's ready." Then the cashier just goes, "He doesn't have money."
I peeked my head in front of me, and sure enough, this guy doesn't have money. I thought it was such a funny thing for the lady to say, "No, he doesn't have money." That's so funny to me—such an outrageous comment! Why did she have to say it like that?
But it was the most direct line to the answer. It wasn't like, "No, you can go ahead; he's not ready," or "He's not ordering." It was just, "He doesn't have money." Obviously, I'm judging the book by its cover, and he just kept standing there, hoping that he could, I don't know, take someone's food that didn't show up or something. I don't know, what are you doing?
| |
Sam Parr | I was in the bathroom at the airport recently. There was a line for the urinal, but there was also a line for the stalls. A guy walked up to me, looked at the stall, and then looked at me. He said, "Are you waiting to poop?"
| |
Shaan Puri | Yeah, dude, people say the weirdest shit, and then you have to answer too, right? Like, you can't not answer that.
Oh my God, why am I paying... playing into this? He was just a dead face.
| |
Sam Parr | he's just looking at it he goes you waiting to poop | |
Shaan Puri | And I was like, a 12-year-old. I don't know why I thought that was so funny. Oh!
| |
Sam Parr | my god I have another business do you wanna talk about business or no | |
Shaan Puri | yeah yeah yeah | |
Sam Parr |
Of course, we're idiots. By the way, if you're listening in Austin, we're doing an event. Well, actually, we're doing two events. I think the second one's not confirmed yet. The second one is Sean and I doing a live pod in late April. We're gonna have more information on that, right?
| |
Shaan Puri | bro that's it's confirmed we're doing it we just don't know the venue yet | |
Sam Parr | we don't know the venue yet | |
Shaan Puri | We need to know: is it going to be 300 people, 1,000 people, or 3,000 people? That's kind of the only thing that we're missing here—how many of you will show up to this live show in Austin?
We're going to put on a little show, have a meet and greet, and maybe do a private dinner with some people afterwards. I think we should do that at the end of April.
Where do they go to sign up for that? We'll put the link in the description here.
| |
Sam Parr | yeah and then go to what what's our website called mfmpod.com mfmpod.com | |
Shaan Puri | which is like my first million pod.com | |
Sam Parr |
And then we're doing another one. This one is not a "we," this is a "me." Sean's not coming to this one. It's just a casual hangout session. We're doing that mid... When is it? Oh, the week mid-March. Is it March 15th? So Wednesday, March 15th. It's free, you could just show up and we're just gonna hang out. You could find that also on mfmpod.com, or by the time this episode airs, I will have tweeted it. So you can go to my Twitter handle @thusampar and see it.
| |
Shaan Puri | sam I'm in a great mood can I tell you why | |
Sam Parr | yes | |
Shaan Puri |
I did something that I forgot is an amazing tactic and technique, so I'm gonna say it out loud here so other people could do it, but also it's a reminder to myself to do it. Have you ever heard of something called **flooding**?
| |
Sam Parr | no is that when you text someone a lot of no I have no idea | |
Shaan Puri | Yeah, it could be a lot of things. Don't look it up on Urban Dictionary; it's probably something weird.
But here's how I learned about it: Tony Robbins talked about this thing. So, someone asked him, "What's some marriage advice or a thing you do in your marriage that makes it better?" He basically had two stories that I really loved. I'll skip the first one for now; I've told it and I teach it in my course.
The second one he mentioned was about once a month, they do something called "flooding." This is basically where they sit down on the couch, you know, like they're about to watch Netflix or something else. But instead of just mindlessly vegging out to some TV, they watch videos or photos from some part of their past—some era of their past.
So, maybe it's a vacation they went on or their wedding, or whatever. You basically get this flood of memories and emotions that are linked and anchored to those moments. But most people don't revisit it in a conscious or intentional way like this.
I do this in two ways: one, I'll do it with life photos or memories, videos or photos. The second one is—and this is the one I did before this—which is why I'm...
| |
Sam Parr | in a blog post or something or go social | |
Shaan Puri | Pull up a bunch of videos that were really funny to me back in the day, back in college, like when YouTube was the new thing.
| |
Sam Parr | e bombs world | |
Shaan Puri |
And like, you know, things would go viral, but it was like... Yeah, e-bombs world. Like things would go viral and everybody knew about that video, you know? Whatever that "Charlie Bit My Finger" or whatever.
But there's this set of videos that were so funny to me, and they're not even that... Now that I go back and look, it's kinda like an old movie where you're like, "Dang, this movie doesn't... it doesn't hold up. It doesn't have the same juice."
Like things are much funnier now. Like the average TikTok is funnier than the best videos back in like 2006.
| |
Sam Parr | which which videos did you look at | |
Shaan Puri | Okay, this is gonna sound dumb, but have you ever seen this video? You know, the one with the 12-year-old boy? Disclaimer: here we go.
Have you ever seen this video of a cop pulling over a guy? The guy has his hands above his head, and it's like, "Yep, yep, yep, yep, yep." The cop is patting him down and says, "Alright, let me just check if I could... hold on, here we go. Up! Hey, what's this?" And the guy goes, "That's my penis." The cop replies, "That's your penis?" Then he continues on. This video cracks me up just the way he goes, "That's my penis," and the guy responds, "That's your penis."
So there's that video, but then there are just a whole bunch of these goofy videos. A lot of them are like, you know, the news anchors interviewing that kid who's like, "I like turtles," or the grape stomp video, or whatever. There are a whole bunch of these, and I watched like six of them. They just cracked me up in this way. It's like a simpler time.
Yeah, the evolution of this life and a mortgage—I didn't have it, you know? Those videos just took me back; they teleported me. So, I highly recommend this idea of flooding. You probably have done some version of this on accident, but like, make it a practice. It's pretty awesome, and it just puts you in an amazing mood. | |
Hubspot | this data is wrong every freaking time | |
Hubspot | Have you heard of HubSpot? HubSpot is a CRM platform where everything is fully integrated.
| |
Hubspot | Woah! I can see the client's whole history: calls, support tickets, emails. And here's a task from three days ago that I totally missed.
| |
Shaan Puri | hubspot grow better | |
Sam Parr |
So, I did it recently... I'm gonna tell a story that you and I were texting about. I can't reveal what I was selling because it was kind of against the law, and I didn't know it at the time, but I tweeted...
| |
Shaan Puri | Out recently, statute of limitations... Yeah, you're way past that. It's been more than 10 years. Is that a real law or is that just something that you're saying?
| |
Sam Parr | that's definitely a that's definitely a | |
Shaan Puri | legal speech | |
Sam Parr | Here's what we'll do. We can mention... I'll say it was alcohol. That's all I will say. It was legal alcohol that I was selling. That's all I'm going to say. I was like, so...
| |
Shaan Puri | many people to specify it was legal probably not a good thing | |
Sam Parr | so well so here's the story I tweeted out that I think I it it always bothers me when when people collect domain names that's a that's a pet peeve because I because I'm saying if you're doing that you're doing the wrong stuff because people will say I'm gonna I've got this great idea I'm gonna buy a domain name or even worse they'll say I've got this amazing domain name I should build something for it I'm like dude don't build something just because you have a domain name so anyway I tweeted out I'm like just make money first and just use like a you know store name dot squarespace dot com for like the initial like $100 in sales and then go and get the domain name like and someone's like you can't do that and I was like oh no I've done it a bunch of times I'm like yeah well you're doing it because you have a name I was like no I did it actually in college tons and tons of times in fact I found this old website that I had and it was alcohol name dot wordpress.com right and I went and looked at the old stats and it's getting 5,000 views a month still on a wordpress.comfreewebsite in this it's a store it's a quote a store that is a blog post and a click to paypal and basically what I did was there was this really unique drink that was sold in nashville and for some reason only 1 or 2 stores were carrying it but this particular type of drink was popular across the country and I thought well I should set up an online store to sell this stuff and I did and I made friends with the person selling at the the liquor store or whatever and I go hey I'm gonna sell this for 3 x markup but I'll buy a bunch of it from you so whatever and I did it and I didn't I'm an idiot I didn't realize that like as this thing was growing I was making like a lot of money and I went and told the legal team at my college I was like hey I think my business is like working really well do I need to set up like an llc or something and they're like oh you're breaking the law like you can't you can't sell this without like a liquor license I was like but it's like a collect basically this thing that I was selling it was a it was a very rare whiskey that was in a very particular type of bottle that was like a collector's item and I thought like it was just like collector's item I don't even know if people are gonna drink this thing so anyway it was making like $1,000 a day sometimes and I looked at the old blog post that I was selling this and it was hilarious and it reminded me like of a simpler time when I was sleeping on a mattress on the floor | |
Shaan Puri | yeah and life was good | |
Sam Parr | and I was building motorcycles in my living room and it was working out well so I was like | |
Shaan Puri |
I was building motorcycles in my living room, sleeping on the floor, and selling collector's whiskey illegally on the internet. It was a simpler time.
| |
Sam Parr | and I know | |
Shaan Puri | The American Dream. The American Dream. I was one of those kids that... I don't know, you probably had this too.
| |
Sam Parr | I didn't have beer. Like, you remember those college kids that would have beer cases, the cardboard on their walls?
| |
Shaan Puri | yeah I | |
Sam Parr |
It wasn't that bad, but I did have an American flag. I definitely had the American flag, so I was pretty trashy. But yeah, I was... I was looking at my old blog that I used to do, and I couldn't even remember the password. So I flooded myself a little [with memories].
| |
Shaan Puri |
I'm just flooding my pants today. It's great. Yeah, the good thing is... by the way, if you're not watching on YouTube, you're missing half of it because Sam's wearing a Harvard sweatshirt while we tell these stories. We just signed about some illegal whiskey... waiting to poop... you made a bunch.
| |
Sam Parr |
Of jokes about the South... This is so stupid. Oh my god.
Alright, I have something for you. So there's this company that's for sale that I came across. Check it out, go to Chambers.com.
Chambers? Okay, yeah... like that Harry Potter stuff.
Chambers and Partners.
| |
Shaan Puri | is that it yeah yeah | |
Sam Parr | Yeah, okay, okay. Dude, check this out.
So this website, I think they're mostly in Europe, but they are in America as well. They put out these rankings once a month or once a quarter, something like that. They go and interview lots of... I think they have 200 employees who do this.
These 200 employees go out and interview different lawyers. They talk to your past clients and try to see which cases you're winning. It's all done manually; there's not a lot of tech behind it. Then they create these rankings for the best legal firms or whatever, like a good firm for this or a good firm for that in different niches.
They put out these rankings, and if you're a lawyer, you can pay money and get a plaque. They'll send you a plaque, and they'll also allow you to use their designation in your emails. It could say "voted a top lawyer by Chambers," and you could do all that.
Dude, this company does ÂŁ44,000,000. So what's that in real money? That's like $60,000,000 in revenue. | |
Shaan Puri | of volume | |
Sam Parr | And then $18,000,000 in profit. They're selling right now for close to $500,000,000. It's a crazy company you sold.
| |
Shaan Puri | it for sale somewhere | |
Sam Parr | Just like on a trade magazine for media companies that I follow, there's a small section called "Flash and Flames." This website covers various topics related to the industry.
| |
Shaan Puri | b to b media stuff because I'm like been obsessed with b | |
Sam Parr | to b database of the b to b media thing flashandflames.com I | |
Shaan Puri | love it okay | |
Sam Parr | it's like my favorite site I didn't even wanna tell people about it because I don't wanna | |
Shaan Puri | I like how you tried to just mutter it that's why I know it's a good one | |
Sam Parr | It's a good one. I'm a paying subscriber to it, which is like ridiculous. But dude, these lawyers pay like $1,500 to $4,000 a year, and they said they have like no churn. They're like, "We have no insurance from us," because these lawyers want it so much.
I am interested in this, and I found like 8 or 9 other businesses. They call them like data businesses or databases or intelligence businesses, and they're not really much tech. But right now, a lot of them are selling for 8 to 10 times revenue. I found 10 examples of companies that have sold in the 8 to 10 times revenue range for one of these data businesses. It's ridiculous. It's crazy.
This sounds like a scheme because what they do is they rank you, and then they go, "Hey, if you want to make a special profile on our website, we'll do that, and it's $4,500 a year." What we'll do is, once ranked, you could purchase this one-pager where you get a profile on our site. It's almost like a Wikipedia page where one of their journalists just writes like 2 paragraphs. It says, "This legal firm is known for X, Y, and Z."
If you're a lawyer, you could put that in your email signature, and you're allowed to do that. Then people can click and see whatever. It's crazy, man. This is a caper they're pulling off, and I love stuff like this. You know, it's like J.D. Power we talked about.
| |
Shaan Puri | You know how you can tell they're smart? Because their logo looks like a medallion. It resembles a special emblem or award.
It's a "C" with these... I don't know what you call them, but they look like petals going around it.
Yeah, put this on the YouTube channel so that people can see it. It's like a reef around it that just looks like something the Olympics in Athens would award to their top performers.
So, they're really playing into the whole thing with their brand, and I think that's pretty cool. I have a business that sold like this.
| |
Sam Parr |
And their name is Partners. I'm gonna create something like this. You know, "Partners Mayonnaise" and "Partners"... We'll just do something for the people, you know? We rank best condiments: "Mayonnaise and Partners." I gotta figure this out. We could put this on the logo.
But I love these rating businesses. What's the one you have that's similar?
| |
Shaan Puri |
So, I was... Have you ever done a trademark search yourself?
"No, what's that like?"
When you start a business and you want to look up if this is a good name, what do you do? Do you pay a lawyer and say, "Hey, could you just tell me if this trademark's available?" Do you do that later once you get going a little bit?
| |
Sam Parr | that later once I get going is there is there an importance to having a trademark | |
Shaan Puri | yeah it's very hard to sell a company without a trademark did you sell the hustle without a trademark | |
Sam Parr | I didn't have a trademark | |
Shaan Puri |
Yeah, typically it's very hard to get acquired without owning your name because it's a giant liability. For example, if somebody else owns a trademark and you get 6 years in, you're going to have to change your name. Because the more valuable you get, the bigger your exposure is for them to say, "I own the trademark, you have to change your name." Or...
| |
Sam Parr | maybe my name I mean it was called the hustle maybe it was too broad of a name you know what I mean | |
Shaan Puri | Well, I don't know. There's probably some troll out there who listened to this and is like, "Hey, hang on, let me go get this guy." So, dude...
| |
Sam Parr | I'm I'm past the reps in warranty like the escrow has been paid out so | |
Shaan Puri | There's a great story in an early episode where Moyse came on and told the Native story. It's like, I don't know, episode 10 of this podcast. Moyse tells a story about when they tried to sell Native. They got in trouble with this because they had a deal to sell Native, and as they were doing the diligence, or like prepping for the diligence, they realized, "Shit, we don't have the trademark for Native deodorants."
So they're like, "Okay, well, let's just get it." And then they find out, "Well, you can't get it because somebody else owns it." They're like, "What? Who owns Native deodorant? There's no other Native deodorant. Look, I have the domain!"
And they're like, "Well, no, there's this guy." I think it was someone in Palo Alto, if I remember this story correctly. I might be butchering a little bit of this, but there was somebody in Palo Alto who was kind of like a patent troll type that owned the name and owned a bunch of names like this.
So he says, "Okay, I guess I can go buy it off them because they're not doing anything with it." He goes to them and tries to buy it for like, whatever, $20,000. They're like, "No." Then he's like, "Okay, yeah, whatever," and goes at $200,000. Still, no. The guy wanted $1,000,000 for this name because he knows your business is valuable. You need this name.
You're going to change your brand name for your consumer packaged good. That's like, you know, you can't change Doritos to be called, you know, like Fluffies tomorrow. It doesn't work; you lose a lot of value.
So they were going back and forth. I forgot exactly how it got resolved, but I think he ended up buying it for $2,000,000 or something like that.
| |
Sam Parr | or moist it I think so | |
Shaan Puri | or something else happened where they like threatened to they were just like alright screw you we're not gonna do it at all and the guy like realized it was like his last ditch effort and like and they ended up getting it for whatever some amount you know I forgot I forgot what it was but they acquired it in the end but yeah anyway so so I've had this problem with a business of mine which was that I up for I'm I'm like you I'm like oh I don't need a fancy domain I don't need a fancy name let me just start the business and go and then I start and it goes and it gets popular and then I'm like okay I should probably like incorporate the company and do like payroll and do like all these things I should I you know I should have been doing in porting but like I didn't wanna do all that stuff if there wasn't like a real business here and so then you try to go back and some things are easier than others to correct going backwards one of the things that's hard to correct is if you chose a name that wasn't right you know you have a problem and so with one of my businesses I had done the actual search myself I should have just paid a lawyer to do it but I went on the uspto search website which I don't know if you've ever gone there it's like you know imagine like a government it's like the dmv website and so you go there you try to search and I search for our brand name and nothing came up but it turns out there's like a fancier way to search where it's like yeah that brand name or like with an s at the end or like with associated other words that would make it too close and I didn't know that and so I remember being so frustrated with this interface and I was like somebody should make a because this is a it's a public database it's like somebody should just make a more consumer friendly layer on top and then I found a business that does this and I got in touch with the guy who who does this so there's a business called trademarkia.com so it's like trademark with I a so trademarkia.com if you go to it all of a sudden it's like like if you just compare side by side like in the youtube channel you should do this like take uspto and try to find even where do you go find search for trademarks and then like how that looks versus this where it just says search 11,000,000 trademarks for free search your thing example mickey mouse and it's like you could just type in your brand name so like if I typed in you know the hustle I'm gonna search for this and it's gonna tell me what trademarks exist for this who owns them | |
Sam Parr | this company kills it | |
Shaan Puri |
"What categories are they in?"
"Okay, so HubSpot... HubSpot owns it now. So it says 'The Hustle, HubSpot owns it.' It's pending and it was filed December 3, 2022. When did you sell?"
| |
Sam Parr | december 3rd when did 2 2 years ago what would that be 21 | |
Shaan Puri | yeah so okay so | |
Sam Parr | wow so they yeah I didn't own it and | |
Shaan Puri | They also... it looks like you abandoned one in 2020. So, you know, somebody did.
| |
Sam Parr | something tried | |
Shaan Puri | On your team, maybe someone tried and didn't get it or whatever. It tells you what class it's in, etcetera, etcetera. So, it's a great, great little thing. You could search for associated names or whatever. It's a great website.
I reached out to the guy who owns it. I was like, "Dude, this is a great idea! Trademarking is a brilliant interface. You know, props to you." He goes, "So, the guy lives in the Bay Area, actually, and he goes, 'Yeah, it's a really cool website. You know, we have $5,000,000 in ARR, and I can't... you know, we never raised VC. $5,000,000 in ARR was kind of declining from the peak, but I just came back to the company, removed the subscription. I got big plans now. I want to talk to you about it.'"
You know, he's going to try to make this like... he wants to go for like the $1,000,000,000 outcome. I was like, "Dude, I think you have a $5,000,000,000 a year cash cow that you could probably get to like $8,000,000,000 or $9,000,000,000 with just some simple tweaks."
You know, chill. That sounds awesome! But I thought this is a really cool website. Again, it's just a simple... like these businesses are everywhere, man. These businesses are hidden in plain sight. In this case, it took a public dataset and just put a much more user-friendly wrapper on top.
Versus what you were talking about with Chambers, they created their own dataset and then they own that proprietary data.
| |
Sam Parr | It's called... you know, Anand from CB Insights was on, and he was like, "No, we just like taking public data that's messy and we just make it a little bit easier to... yeah, we just make it clean."
By the way, my first million is owned by Advanced Magazine Publishers, which is a big company in New York. It's an entertainment service, namely an online, non-downloadable video series featuring star athletes explaining their life as millionaires. I guess that's that GQ thing which I see when I search on YouTube.
But anyway, badass! I love this.
| |
Shaan Puri | Fact: You want to hear? I'm going to go trademark this before this episode comes out because now somebody's going to go "squat" on this.
| |
Sam Parr | Do you want to hear a funny story about Native Deodorant? I've always remembered this story, but I never brought it up to you.
So, you and I were at the Hustle's office, and Twitch's office was just a block, or like 50 yards, from each other. If you know, there was a tourney or whatever, you would go to the left. If you went to the right, there was a little café that I really liked.
I believe it was called Native. So, Native Deodorant is a company that sells deodorant. It was sold for $100,000,000 in cash, and it probably does $100,000,000 now. They have really cute branding; they make shampoo and everything.
I remember walking by this lovely café and thought, "This café is called Native too," and their logo looked just like Native Deodorant. I realized that Moise worked nearby, so I put two and two together.
If you Google "Native Co SF," you'll see a little café. You'll see their Yelp page. They've changed their logo to green, but it used to be blue—the exact same color as Native Deodorant. So, I have a feeling that he was just thinking of good branding. | |
Shaan Puri | I remember thinking, "Dude, boys, they're ripping off your brand. Are you doing it exactly?" And now it's realized, the obvious. He was like, "Alright, I need a name." He looked out the window and saw it. It was like, "That's my name and my logo now, and that's mine."
If you go to this... if you look up Native Code, it's exactly the same. It's exactly the same, and it used to be blue. It looked like there.
| |
Sam Parr | looked like there was covid they | |
Shaan Puri | like nivea blue | |
Sam Parr |
It was the same white background with the same blue, and now it's green. It looks like they closed during COVID and they moved to a new location. But that old location that we were at, it was the same logo and it was called Native Co. I think Native Deodorant was...
| |
Shaan Puri | The domain was also Native Co for him. Yes, it was the exact same thing. | |
Sam Parr | And so, he must have been just walking down the street and he goes, "Yep, that's me. That's mine now." You know, it's just like there's that meme on the internet of a stick figure handing an item to another stick figure saying, "Hey, I made this," and then the second stick figure looks at it and goes, "I made this."
That's basically what just happened. I don't think I've ever said this to him, but I would love to hear what his rebuttal is. He 100% stole the entire branding, the name, everything from this company. I don't know if "stealing" is the right word, but kinda.
| |
Shaan Puri |
I mean, that one looks like stealing. It looks like he actually went and took a screwdriver, took their sign off their office, moved it across the street, and put it on his office. It's the exact logo. I remember seeing that for years and being like... and I just never put two and two together. I didn't realize he worked there, but I was like, "Wow, they're really ripping off his branding."
| |
Sam Parr | no that's that cafe has been there for years I remember walking by it for years | |
Shaan Puri |
Well, now they're shut down. That's... I mean, this is like everything that's wrong in society, you know? He sells his business for $100,000,000, poor cafe shuts down... Sadly, during COVID, during the pandemic. This is the way the world is going, dude.
Have you seen people ripping us off? I don't know if you've seen this, but...
| |
Sam Parr | no but that's cool | |
Shaan Puri | In the next two weeks, you're going to see Twitter threads, LinkedIn posts, short videos on TikTok, and other podcasts talking about the exact same stories that we tell here.
There's like this group of ten people that just take our content and then they just say the exact same thing. They tell that exact same story. They're going to be like, "Dude, Dave Ramsey! How Dave Ramsey built a $600,000,000 empire!" Animation, this, that, and then they're just going to literally steal our shtick.
It's kind of annoying. I get it. Michael from Our Future has done it a few times. Yeah, they do. He's one of the ten that does this all the time. | |
Sam Parr | who are the other 9 | |
Shaan Puri | I mean, I don't even really want to give him shine for doing that. You know, this is literally for those people who have their own silent embarrassment.
There's nothing wrong with sort of taking ideas and remixing them, but what most people do is they just take the same idea. They tell the same story the same way we already told it, in their own Twitter thread or their own LinkedIn, and whatever else.
Which is fine, but like, give credit at least. If you're going to say the same thing, be like, "Oh, I was listening to My First Million, and they told this great story. Check it out!"
I think that's a slightly better way to do it, but you know, whatever it is.
| |
Sam Parr |
It is. Why? So, I have a new project I'm actually going to announce in about a month or 3 weeks. This is why I didn't announce it: I've been working on this for almost a year now. I didn't want to announce it [because of] copycats.
Everyone talks about "building in public." I hate building in public. Building in public is not cool when you're popular. Building in public is really cool when you want to get popular.
| |
Shaan Puri | yeah exactly | |
Sam Parr | but once you already have a following I don't wanna do it like the milk road did you guys have a bunch of copy cats | |
Shaan Puri | Yeah, yeah, tons. There are tons of embarrassing ones that are out there. There are people who literally just took the same exact newsletter and some people would translate it. They'd say, "Oh, I'm, you know, leche leche," whatever, and it's like the Mexican Milk Road. Then it would translate into Spanish just like Google Translate and then publish it.
There's another one that... I don't know if I want to put this guy on blast, but someone who tried to buy the Milk Road and failed.
| |
Sam Parr | yeah | |
Shaan Puri | I know you don't. Then, he just tried to copy it in his own way. The funny thing is, they very rarely work.
| |
Sam Parr | they don't | |
Shaan Puri |
It's kind of surprising why they don't work. I expected them to work. For example, when people take our content and then write a thread about it on LinkedIn, it does pretty good. That kind of works for them, otherwise they wouldn't really keep doing it.
But copying the whole newsletter thing... for some reason, that doesn't really work. I'm not 100% sure why.
| |
Sam Parr | Explain why I know. Why do you want to know?
So basically, for people who have been raised on the internet, they have a very high bullshit detector. Do you want to know the best way to circumvent someone's bullshit detector?
No, don't bullshit. You don't bullshit. That's how you circumvent that bullshit detector. You don't bullshit, and people can sniff this out.
If they read something and it's like, "Dude, you're like an not cool older guy trying to act like a cool younger person," I know that this is not good. This doesn't work.
| |
Shaan Puri | I told you about the NQR, right? The KFCs in China—"Not Quite Right." It's like, dude, it's the same menu. This is the spicy chicken sandwich, and it's like, "That's not quite right." People say it just doesn't taste right; their taste buds reject it.
Now, I believe that when it comes to using one product and then somebody tries to copy it, I'm like, "Why would I want the shitty copy? I'm just going to keep going with the original."
But in markets where you're reaching a new audience or people who haven't heard of the original, I'm surprised it doesn't work. I think my theory of why it doesn't work in those cases is that you're right. When people have tasted the original, then they don't really want the... well, you know, the inferior version.
| |
Sam Parr | Or when it's like community, community brand, like personality-driven. You know, it's that one mote that Peter Thiel doesn't understand: brand.
| |
Shaan Puri | Yeah, yeah, the one Asperger-proof defense, the one Asperger-proof weapon we have.
So, you know, the one thing that I think is true is this iceberg theory. If you look at an iceberg, the part you see at the top is like 5% of the total mass that's there.
What I think people get wrong when they try to copy a business is that they only see the top, the 5%, and they're like, "Oh, okay, I'm gonna copy that." But they don't know what goes on underneath. They don't know that basically the uncopyable thing is the people, the personalities, the engine underneath that's coming up with the creative ideas, that's coming up with the next marketing thing because this one starts to decline.
So, I think that's the part that's typically hard to copy. But honestly, I'm surprised that more of them don't work because if you're sufficiently talented, I think it sadly does work more often than it doesn't. | |
Sam Parr | We should do an episode where we talk about the things that people have copied and that have become better than the original.
There are stories of the Samwer brothers. They are three brothers in Germany, and they have a company called Rocket Internet. It was a clone factory. Basically, it was publicly traded until recently. The reason they started this company was that they cloned Amazon and all these other companies like Zappos and Uber.
Before they started that company, they cloned other things and sold them back to the originals. For example, they cloned eBay in Germany and sold it back to eBay for $90 million in about three months. Then they were going to do the same thing with Groupon, but they got bigger than Groupon. They realized, "Oh wow, once you get huge, this business sucks. We gotta offload it."
They tried to do that with Zappos, the shoe company, but they got bigger than the original Zappos. Their market cap was larger, so they couldn't sell it. This is their whole strategy. It's a very fascinating strategy, and so far, it hasn't panned out for them other than with HelloFresh. They copied Blue Apron, and HelloFresh worked.
| |
Shaan Puri | Right, yeah. I think there's an art to copying. This is a whole topic; I think we could do a whole podcast about it. If you're going to copy, here's how to do it. Here's how to do it in a way that feels good to your soul, feels good to customers, actually works, and is not just going to result in a massive waste of time.
I think there are a bunch of different little factors involved. One example is what the Sam Moore brothers did. They operated the same business in a different country. So, I think geographic differentiation is important. You can copy and make things work when you do have a geographic difference, but there are some traps with that too that we could discuss.
Alright, where do you want to finish up? I think we should... well, there is one thing that we should do.
| |
Sam Parr | yeah I forgot about that thing | |
Shaan Puri | aware of it I think I'm aware of it I can't seem to find my pen but I | |
Sam Parr | need that's okay you don't need you don't need a pen so basically but | |
Shaan Puri | I thought I'd decide something some sort of a you | |
Sam Parr | Do you sign it? Just with a click of a button.
So basically, at this podcast, "My First Million," our content, unlike every other content on YouTube, is actually not free. It's not a free podcast because what you have to do, if you've seen more than one episode, is this thing called the "gentleman's agreement."
It's called that because I'm not there behind you to stare at your screen. That's why it's an honor code agreement. You have to basically go and click subscribe on YouTube because we'll get more subscribers, which helps the algorithm. We get more views, and then we'll do more dumb stuff for you.
So it's called the "gentleman's agreement." If you watch more than one video, you have to do this. Everyone's doing it.
| |
Shaan Puri | I have an addendum to the gentleman's agreement. It came from a listener; she pointed it out. She goes, "Not only have I signed the gentleman's agreement, I've signed the ladies' understanding."
| |
Sam Parr | and I thought the ladies' understanding | |
Shaan Puri | You know, there are not many phrases that will stop me in my tracks, but I was stopped in my tracks by the ladies' understanding. I thought that was phenomenal.
| |
Sam Parr | The ladies understanding, that's actually when you also click "subscribe" on the iTunes or the podcast app and the Spotify app.
| |
Shaan Puri | you go that extra mile | |
Sam Parr | go that extra mile and give us the ladies understanding along with the gentleman's agreement | |
Shaan Puri | Since we started doing this, there are two things about gentleman's spirit.
Number one, it's funny because we're talking about copying. You stole the shtick from somebody that we're trying...
| |
Sam Parr | To make, dude, I stole it. He called me, by the way, and he was like, "Isn't that awesome? It works so good!" He invited me to go to a UFC fight.
| |
Shaan Puri |
And you did it right because you gave credit to him. You put your own spin on it, and yeah, you credited him most importantly as being like, "This guy did this awesome thing and I was like, 'Wow, I gotta try doing this.'" So you know, you credited him and that's cool that you guys are going to see a fight together. That's amazing.
Now, it's cute... The second thing is we have grown a lot since we did this. So we started doing this, we were at... What did you... The first time you did it, I believe you had 145,000 subscribers on YouTube?
| |
Sam Parr | that's like a month ago | |
Shaan Puri | We have... yeah, that was like, maybe 45 days ago, something like that. And now we're at 180,000. The people who watch the YouTube videos, they know this. In fact, I'm looking at a tweet right now, which he goes... he just @mentioned us. He goes, "Watching on YouTube is better than Spotify."
But yeah, no shit! I told you this. It is way better to watch the show on YouTube.
In fact, what I think we should do to really juice the agreement, to even add more... you know, see Appendix A of the gentleman's agreement, I think we should do a piece of content that is only good when you watch it.
So here's my proposal to you, Sam. I think we should do basically like... shirtless. Yeah, Sam's gonna be shirtless, and I'm gonna screen share.
So I think we should screen share us going through a pitch deck and making it a good idea, one from average to awesome, or like good to great. We'll just show how we would tweak the copy, how we would make it look better, and we'll use a real one.
So I think we should do that and put that only on the YouTube channel because it would only make sense to see it.
| |
Sam Parr | No, I think that on YouTube, you should log in to Chase.com and show your checking account. Yeah, okay, and it will react, but we won't say the number.
| |
Shaan Puri | That's genius! You know, this is why you complete me, bro. I gave you a shitty idea, and you gave me the old "yes, and..." | |
Sam Parr | We're going to go to Chase.com or whatever bank you use, like Bank of America. You're going to log in, and we're just going to watch you do that and react. That's it.
| |
Shaan Puri | By the way, the "yes, yes, and" is the corniest thing that the startup world tried to take from the cool, you know, people who are actually funny. Because actually, it's a "no, but," which is what you just did there. "No, but we should do this instead" is a better rhythm.
| |
Sam Parr | People and improv people are one step below acapella people in terms of the nerds.
| |
Shaan Puri | so like there's no way we're cool and improv people | |
Sam Parr | You ever been around an improviser? It's like being around someone who does CrossFit. You know, just stop talking about it! I can't stand improv people; they're exhausting. It's like people without muscle.
| |
Shaan Puri | dude | |
Sam Parr | I... the avant said it's like a blind Jack Russell. You know what those are? It's like that dog that's yapping everywhere, and when it's blind, you just can't stop it. It's going all over the place. That's what I feel about an improv person.
| |
Shaan Puri | Yeah, I think you're right. I did improv, so I can confirm this is correct. You're correct that it's below a cappella, which is below anything that's actually cool.
| |
Sam Parr | Yeah, acapella is the worst of the worst. I remember hanging out with people from New England, and they were bragging about acapella. I was like, "Dude, shut up! Why are you talking about that? You don't want people to know."
| |
Shaan Puri | And they were like acapella people hanging out with each other. They were ordering or waiting for their food at the table. Then one guy's like... as they start harmonizing, it's like, "Dude, you gotta stop!" You know? Yeah, if I hear...
| |
Sam Parr | the lion king song one more time I'm gonna put a bullet in my head that's how I feel when when I'm with these people | |
Shaan Puri | I've been trapped on a subway, and like, they do a flash mob around me and start singing. Oh, those people!
| |
Sam Parr | are are above flash mob people are are are above the acapella | |
Shaan Puri | I'm gonna do something I'm gonna start vomiting just to out out outrageous them in that moment | |
Sam Parr | that's the pod |